HomeMy WebLinkAboutminutes.apz.20081007Aspen Planning & ZOning Commission Meeting Minutes
October 07, 2008
COMMENTS ............................................................................................................ 2
MINUTES ................................................................................................................. 2
DECLARATION OF CONFLICTS OF INTEREST ............................................... 2
LIFT ONE COWOP MASTER PLAN ..................................................................... 3
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Aspen Plannine & Zonine Commission Meetin¢ Minutes
October 07, 2008
LJ Erspamer opened the regular Planning & Zoning Commission Meeting at 4:30
pm in the Sister Cities Meeting Room. Commissioners present were Mike
Wampler, Cliff Weiss, Stan Gibbs, Dina Bloom, Jim DeFrancia and LJ Erspamer.
Bert Myrin, alternate, was also present. Brian Speck was excused. Staff present
Jim True, Special Counsel; Chris Bendon, Travis Goggins, Community
Development; Jackie, Lothian, Deputy City Clerk.
COMMENTS
Cliff Weiss said that his opinion was that 11 minutes was too long for public
comments. LJ Erspamer stated that the public comments did get out of hand at the
last meeting and he apologized to Andrew Kole. Andrew Kole accepted the
apology.
Bert Myrin asked if there was a current version of the development pipeline; the
one he had was from 2006. Chris Bendon replied that they will provide it as soon
as they can.
Jim True said that City Council has not taken formal action on appointing Bert
Myrin therefore Bert should not vote tonight but it is up to the desecration of the
chair on comments.
Toni Kronberg, public, said that it concerns her that a member of Planning &
Zoning said that the public comments has gone overboard; she stated that it is the
charge of the Planning & Zoning Commission, your job is one to listen to the
public and your job is to plan and zone the community. Kronberg said the purpose
of public comment is to give the public an opportunity to comment on whatever
they want to whether it is in public comment or an application. Kronberg said that
they had a serious application that they were looking at tonight; she said the
community has entrusted a lot of their future into P&Z hands.
Jackie Lothian reminded the commission that there was a special meeting next
week at the Aspen Meadows and there would be a site visit for the ZG Master Plan
at noon on October 14th.
MINUTES
MOTION.• Cliff Weiss moved to approve the minutes of September 16`x; seconded
by Jim DeFrancia. All in favor, APPROVED.
DECLARATION OF CONFLICTS OF INTEREST
None stated.
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Aspen Planning & ZOnInE Commission MeetinE Minutes
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CONTINUED PUBLIC HEARING:
LIFT ONE COWOP MASTER PLAN
LJ Erspamer opened the continued public hearing on the Lift One COWOP Master
Plan.
Chris Bendon stated this was a continued public hearing on Lift One
Neighborhood Master Plan and this was the 5`h meeting on this project. Bendon
provided the proposed resolution. Bendon noted the power point presentations
were part of the record as well as the website referenced as an exhibit.
Bendon utilized power point for an updated site plan with a new poma lift from
Willoughby Park through the site using the original Lift One alignment; the was a
new quad lift located up the hill, which was Lift OneA now; the Skiers Chalet
building moves down hill to the north and becomes a new commercial facility
(hopefully a Boots & Beer kind of Pub); the old ski ticket booth will be kept in and
a portion rehabilitated; the Skier Chalet Lodge moves down into Willoughby Park
as the ski museum; Lodge at Aspen Mountain on the west side of the site with
some street trees along Dean Street. The conservation zone will be rezoned as
lodge; the new Skiers Chalet would be rezoned Neighborhood Commercial to
allow for all the uses; rezone the park to public which would allow for the museum
as well as the Lift One park; the far corner of the Lodge at Aspen Mountain
rezoned as RMF to accommodate Affordable Housing and everything with a PUD
overlay which will manage the dimensions of the project.
Bendon said that the reduction of the mass utilized setbacks and notches, stepping
of the structures and lay height against the slope. Bendon reiterated from the last
hearing the architectural styles of Rustic Colorado Mountain Lodge, Victorian
shingle, Western Parks Lodge and Mountain Eclectic. Bendon said that there were
3 perspectives on the power point presentation: one from the cul-de-sack looking
up; looking up South Aspen Street and the 3`d is looking up the ski corridor.
Bendon said there was language for the construction management on page 25 of
the decision packet. Bendon said the group was comfortable with housing 60% of
the employees generated by the development. Bendon said that they wanted to
attach the decision packet to the resolution.
Stan Gibbs asked if there was any more discussion on the volley ball courts.
Bendon replied there is with a letter from Bob Daniel on the relocation. Bendon
stated that per the Parks Department they just built a championship grass court at
Koch Lumber Park; Parks did not see the need for additional full time sand courts
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and that was why the champion court was built as a grass court. Bendon said Parks
and the Task Force were excited about the idea of a temporary sand court that
could facilitate the MotherLode Operation, which could be done on a street right-
of-way next to Koch Lumber or in this site or could be moved around from year to
year.
Gibbs asked if there was further discussion about transportation into town and how
that would work. Bendon responded that there was a use tax that the developer has
to pay and that subsidizes in town transit; there was no real way to do an
"earmark" project but the estimate was $3.7 million from both projects going to
that use tax; the idea was to have enhanced in town transit possibly as an extension
of the Galena Street Shuttle serving this neighborhood as a regular route. There
was a lot of question about the seasonality of that but there was good reception for
that as an enhanced city route. In terms of the plan itself there has been
conversation between the 2 developers for combining their shuttle services so there
wouldn't be duplicated or overlap services. Cliff Weiss said the group spoke about
carshare vehicles for the project.
Bendon noted other questions from P&Z were the Juan Street corridor and that
pedestrian corridor has been enhanced through those 2 buildings to widen the
corridor to about 30 feet. Bendon said there has been exploration for that corridor
to be widened and the bridge heightened enough for fire truck access, which may
help some of the turnaround diameter at the end of Garmisch as it turns into Juan
Street before it dead ends. There were questions about the profile of commercial
mix within the project; both of the hotels will have restaurants; Lift One is looking
at having an Apres deck at the top adjacent to the lift as well as some commercial
associated with the ski company (ticket sales, ski patrol) and both lodges will have
commercial associated with ski lodges. Bob Daniel said that the ground floor of
the Skiers Chalet Steakhouse was about 1350 square feet interior, which they hope
would be a fun beer joint with whatever kind of cooking facilities that they can
squeeze into that as well and a deck off the northwest side.
Bendon said there was a desire for the platter lift because the platters can be pulled
off and so the whole ski corridor could be used as opposed to the rope tow which
kind of cuts that in half which makes it difficult for the ski corridor to work as it
should.
Bendon said that affordable housing serves the immediate needs of the short term
employees of lodging with kind of dorm style affordable housing, rental style
program. Both lodges are likely to have an off-site component to compliment the
full 60% affordable housing mitigation, it is expected to be a public private
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October 07, 2008
partnership. Bendon said on the northwest side of the project there would be some
affordable housing.
Gibbs asked if the parking was available for public parking. Bendon replied there
was public parking but it was one of the push and pull numbers to minimize some
of the extra costs of the development. John Sarpa and Bob Daniel replied 80
spaces. Daniel said there were about 35 spaces in the Willoughby Park parking lot
and 45 spaces strung out on South Aspen Street just below the ski company turn
around at the top all the way down to Durant; those spaces are what are being
jointly replaced in a structure below grade that would be accessible. Daniel said
this was what was in the current approval decision package. Bendon said that may
move around a little bit when you get into design; it might be a few more or a few
less parking spaces.
Dina Bloom asked if there would be any storefront commercial on the street or was
everything in the hotels. Daniel replied the restaurant space would be accessible to
the street and would not be a through lobby restaurant space and there was an
additional small area storefront that was provided for the Ski Company ticketing,
which hasn't been worked out yet and everything else would be residential in
character in terms of the streetscape going up South Aspen Street. Sarpa said all
fides of the building contain the commercial and restaurant spaces.
Michael Wampler asked if the street going up the hill would be heated and asked if
there would be sidewalks. Bendon replied yes and yes. Daniel noted that the
sidewalk was on one side of the street and connected with Durant Street. Daniel
described the buildings with the Lift One having a flat roof style because they were
looking for vegetated roofs as a contribution towards the LEED point system and
as a differentiation between the styles of the buildings.
LJ Erspamer wanted to know which portions were private and which were public.
Bob Daniel responded that the street is public, all of the restaurant space and Apres
deck at the top of the Lift One Lodge was public, within the interior of the building
for members and guests of the lodge there was a small private area. Daniel said the
upper elevation was to have a deck to hang out on and watch races from World
Cup and the Aspen Valley Ski Club and other things that happen up there to
activate that space.
Erspamer asked if there was any idea the number of trips per day on vehicles; he
said that he requested a drop off place for courtesy vans. Cliff Weiss replied there
was quite a discussion on courtesy vans to combine the efforts of the 2 properties.
Bendon said East Hyman and East Hopkins on the other side of Original had trips
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per day of roughly 4,000 to 6,000 trips per day and Durant was in the 15,000 trips
per day.
Wampler asked what would stop the vehicle from going all the way to the top with
skis. Bendon stated this was discussed by the group and there was discussion of
this being open and accessible and not feeling like a private enclave and at the
same times not incurring trips that aren't necessary; there was a whole variety of
opinions and it ended up with the street being open and public; you can drop off
people at the top and the public parking access and public lockers are down which
may help. Daniel said that they don't want cars up there but at the same time they
don't want it to be gated. Gibbs asked the elevation from the upper drop off to the
maze. Daniel answered 27 feet. Weiss said that this was the double black
diamond side of the mountain, there is no easy way, and summer road is gnarly.
Weiss said that he teaches kids skiing and they wouldn't take kids under a level 5
on Aspen Mountain and most hotel guests are going to end up going to the
gondola.
Gibbs asked about the 4 scores in the packets and asked what the best was and
what the worst was. Bendon responded the group provided a thumbs up, sideways
and down on each goal; History 19 up and 2 down and the second was 19 up 2
down; Accessibility 19 up 2 down and 20 up 1 down; Vitality 19 up 1 middle 1
down and the second goa120 up 1 in the middle and 0 down; Sustainability 15 up 5
in the middle and 1 down. Bendon said the vote on the overall plan with 19 up 1 in
the middle and 1 down.
Erspamer asked if this was a discretionary or were there criteria for judgment.
Bendon responded in the resolution that set up the COWOP there are criteria for
City Council's review so after the task force makes the recommendation then staff
analyzes the proposal according to those criteria that are identified; PUD,
Subdivision, etc. Bendon said for this review typically P&Z doesn't have any
review or process in a COWOP but City Council wanted to get the P&Z opinion on
the Master Plan. Erspamer wanted to make sure that it was clear on what P&Z was
deciding on.
Bendon described the resolution with the first part describing the partners involved
and a reason for going into a master plan review; the lands that are managed by the
City of Aspen; exhibit A the legal descriptions of all of those lands; reference to
the COWOP eligibility resolutions; identifies the process of the task force team to
develop a master plan for the site; describes who participated in the task force
team; meeting schedule with a total of 27 meetings from April 10`h to October 2"a;
goals adopted by the task force group and acknowledged by City Council;
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reference to the style of meetings as a public hearing format; the P&Z was
updated; P&Z was required to make a recommendation to City Council; P&Z
public hearing dates; the legal descriptions.
Public Comments:
Toni Kronberg, public, asked if this was a quasi judicial hearing or legislative
hearing. Jim True suggested that the commission not get into an exchange about
these questions. Kronberg asked for a copy of the notice that was provided for the
public hearing that is posted so that we have an understanding what the Planning &
Zoning is reviewing tonight and asked the procedural rules that were established
for the conduct of this meeting and what the criteria of the law of the standards of
reason that you are applying to make determination whether you are going to
approve this recommendation; the reason why she asked that was it is the public's
reason why you have these public hearings is to give the public an opportunity to
comment on the proposed master plan. Kronberg said that she did not know what
the proposed master plan was technically; she wasn't quite sure what all the
rezonings were; the city public rights-of ways. Kronberg stated concern for the
access and if the master plan was binding and how this was compatible with the
Aspen Area Community Plan. Kronberg voiced concern for the heights, mass and
scale, transportation, view corridors, Lift OneA access. Kronberg read a letter
from Mike Marolt regarding the Lift One Proposal to deny the request.
Bill Wiener, public, stated his background in architecture and urban design.
Wiener said that his one goal was to represent everyone. Wiener said that he voted
sideways on the COWOP and it has some problems and it was missing a vision.
Wiener said there were many unsolved issues; there was no design program.
Wiener said there was no plan for the parking and the 2 lodges were tied together
and there was another plan but he was not allowed to present it. Wiener said that
the Parks Lodge design would be too big and massive.
Andrew Kole, public, stated that Bill has his opinion and that was his right but
Kole disagreed with Bill wanting to go in a different direction. Kole said that there
was not anything perfect. Kole said that Mike Marolt was a good friend of his and
he didn't think that Mike really knew what was going on with the COWOP
because he had never attended a meeting. Kole said that he disagreed with Toni
even though she was at many meetings her interpretation was not necessarily
accurate according to Kole. Kole said now when you look up the street all that you
see is pavement and that view will be vastly improved; the traffic problems need to
be addressed because there were hotels going up there. Kole said the mass and
scale were there because the group wanted the poma lift and affordable housing on
site. Kole noted the group incorporated 27 people and over 1600 hours and
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Aspen Planning & Zonin¢ Commission Meetin¢ Minutes
October 07, 2008
another 600 hours of experts and thought the group did a good job with what they
were charged with all the pieces and parts.
Bob Daniel represents Lift One Lodge acknowledged the work the 27 members of
the public and city staff and Clif£ Daniel asked the commission to recommend
approval to Council.
John Sarpa represents Centurion and said that he has never seen a more thorough
public process because there were so many ideas that came over the 6 months and
came through with some major breakthroughs. Sarpa asked the commission to
recommend the plan to the Council.
Erspamer closed the public hearing.
Bendon stated there was a copy of the notice on file in the Planning Office.
Bendon said that in Council's Resolution 13-08 the criteria were laid out and the
lands were described in the P&Z Resolution and the decision packet and the power
point. Bendon said that there was enough information for a broad vision, the
architectural and design plans have been achieved. Bendon referenced the task
force and minutes of the task force and the project binder, which is almost identical
to the website.
Weiss said that he did not plan to be an obstructionist; there were certain things
that the COWOP dealt with that were big broad strokes and took a lot of juggling
and then the Ski Company has not been involved like the developers were
involved. Weiss asked for an amendment to the resolution that says "the Ski
Company must state in writing their commitments to grooming the lift operations
for the new platter lift". Weiss said the truck deliveries to the museum were not
really dealt with and none of the buildings were 80 feet; the group felt it was more
important to preserve the original historic lift one view corridor than it was to
preserve the South Aspen Street view corridor.
Jim DeFrancia commended the COWOP with 2000 hours in a period of 6 months
and what they have come up with is a solution that addresses the great majority of
the issues; it is a plan that will give some vitality to that part of town. DeFrancia
agreed with Cliff on the Ski Company amendment to the resolution.
Erspamer asked who owns the corridor where the poma is. Bendon replied that the
City, Roaring Fork Lodging and Ski Company.
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October 07, 2008
Stan Gibbs stated the COWOP did a tremendous job and all the concerns have
been addressed.
Michael Wampler agreed that the COWOP did a really good job.
Dina Bloom agreed that the COWOP did a really good job and still had some
concerns and was worried about the vitality.
Weiss said that they did not want a lot of retail in the site but wanted a "lights on"
neighborhood so they required a great deal of the affordable housing on site (about
100 employees on site); there will be other small commercial available.
DeFrancia said that this sector of the City will have vitality with the lodges and
restaurants. Bloom said that a lot could be done. Weiss said that the downtown
core was only a few blocks away and the task force did not want this to be an
annex to the core. the Ski Company must state in writing their commitments to
grooming the lift operations for the new platter lift
MOTION.• Jim DeFrancia moved to adopt Resolution #31-08 recommending the
approval of the Lift One Neighborhood Master Plan with the amendment that the
Ski Company shall provide the operation and maintenance for the new poma lift
and quad lift and grooming of the Lift One area for City Council's review and that
the City should address courtesy van drop off points within the city to include
transportation up into Galena Street; Mike Wampler seconded. Roll call: Weiss,
yes; Bloom, yes; Gibbs, yes; Wampler, yes; DeFrancia, yes; Erspamer, yes.
APPROVED 6-0.
Discussion:
Bert Myrin asked Chris Bendon what the top 3 wrinkles were. Bendon said there
was a three dimensional plan on the interior that was one of the details to be
worked out.
Erspamer asked that the city make sure there were courtesy van drop off points in
town. Gibbs asked that the language be broadened to include the transportation for
the shuttle up into the Galena Street.
Adjourned at 6:55 pm.
~ D
ackie Lothian, Deputy City Clerk
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