HomeMy WebLinkAboutminutes.hpc.20090527ASPEN HISTORIC PRESERVATION COMMISSION
MINUTES OF MAY 27, 2009
Vice-chairperson, Sarah Broughton called the meeting to order at 5:00 p.m.
Commissioners in attendance: Brian McNellis, Nora Berko and Jay Maytin.
Ann Mullins and Michael Hoffman were excused.
Staff present: Jim True, Special Counsel
Amy Guthrie, Preservation Officer
Sara Adams, Historic Preservation Planner
Kathy Strickland, Chief Deputy City Clerk
219 S. Third Street -Historic Landmark Designation, Lot Split,
Conceptual, FAR bonus, Variances
Amy reminded the board that at the last meeting designation and the lot split
were voted on. What we need to do is resolve the treatment of the Modern
Chalet and the addition proposed to it. Previously there was a request to
waive the rear lot line and HPC's concern was to maintain a buffer to the
trail. The applicant has revised the plan and pulled back five feet. They still
need a five foot variance but have cut the request in half. Five feet was
requested on the west side and has been revised to three feet. A shed roof
was proposed on the addition and it has come back to a flat roof. The height
and profile of the chalet has been pulled down. Windows are proposed that
will be addressed at final. There are variances proposed to grant even
though they are just recognizing existing conditions. The alley is the front
yard and there is a 25 foot front yard setback requirement and the building is
at 8.6. The request is 16.6 feet. There is also a variance request for the side
due to the existing carport. There is a 500 square foot bonus being asked
for. Overall this project is deserving and it is a lot split scenario where very
little square footage is being attached to the historic building and the rest is
in the new structure. If there was no lot split and someone wanted to add on
directly you would probably triple the size of the modern chalet which
would create an awkward relationship that doesn't preserve its scale.
Instead the Modern Chalet is approximately 1700 square feet of FAR with
a1000 square foot addition to it. The rest of the structure would be a
detached building on the new lot.
FAR:
The applicant thought the chalet was 1500 square feet but actually it is 1700
square feet. When they pulled in the addition from the setback line they lost
some square footage. Most of the construction is being detached which is
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successful. This building is very intact on the inside and outside and we
don't see anything proposed as contrary to maintaining that condition. We
like the placement of the addition. The only potential alternation to the
house itself is reconstruction and repair of the rear deck which has a railing
that doesn't meet code. At final the applicant will discuss a possible
addition of windows on the front fagade. We feel this is a successful project
that warrants the FAR bonus.
Residential Design Standard Variances: Amy said the variances are for
existing conditions. 1. The building is not oriented in a manner that the
standards ask for. 2. The principle window doesn't face the street. Staff
recommends approval and the amount of square footage proposed is within
the guidelines and it is a very successful project.
Suzanne Foster, owner thanked the HPC for their comments. After
incorporating the recommendations the scale is better and we are much
happier. We thought the original calculation was 1533square feet but there is
more space which brings it to 1750 which is a 280 square foot difference.
We are actually loosing 280 square feet which we thought we could add on
and now we can't.
Bill Maron -Stryker Brown architects.
Bill explained that the calculation error was done by their firm. The roof
form was a shed roof and from a massing stand point it has been lowered to
a flat roof. The flat roof is more in keeping with the design standards.
Bill and Suzanne went over the design of the addition with the flat roof and
the connection. The addition comes in from under the car port.
Sarah opened the public hearing on mass and scale of the addition.
Junee Kirk - I am on the criteria subcommittee. This style of architecture
has not met the approval of the majority of our task force. We haven't had a
total vote. If you go this route it would be far better visually to see this
exceptional style repeated. You have a low connector then repeat the style.
We want this style to be part of our history and why do we have a box with a
roof design that is flat and doesn't fit in at all. With Victorian's we have
connectors that are one story. I don't see why this can't be a connector that
is one story and the addition being repeated the same only a smaller scale as
to what is existing. Most of the neighbors would not object to that so much.
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You have to repeat these lines and not have a box. I'm saying it is a bit too
contrasting.
Jake Vickery echoed Junee's concerns. The flat roof seems arbitrary and
unrelated to the existing resource. The real issue is that this building has a
terrible relationship to Third Street and yet it is the main street that it is on.
That issue needs acknowledge or addressed. Possibly use a pathway or gate
that leads into the property.
Heidi Hoffman, architect said we are getting someplace and it has come a
long way. I would like to see the connector unit dropped down and the roof
form modified. I would look at a sloped roof or possibly a dormer. The
chalet should remain in its current location.
Vice-chair Sarah Broughton closed the public hearing.
Nora explained that her concern with the pitched roof was not the style; it
was the height of the pitched roof.
Brian referenced guideline 10.4 - design a new addition to be recognized as
a product of its own time. An addition should be made distinguishable from
the historic building. The addition should have subtle changes. The flat roof
does make the addition a product of its own time and more distinguishable
from the historic resource. It might not be sympathetic enough to the
historic resource. The flat roof is successful as it creates its own component.
The height on the addition can come down a little further in order to make it
more submissive to the historic resource. We also need to address how the
house works with Third Street. Unfortunate the house is orientation toward
the alley.
Suzanne said she will incorporate fencing or something in the landscaping to
address Third Street.
Jay thanked the applicant for working together with the HPC. The flat roof
and connector are his concerns. The addition barely connects with the chalet
and it is very sympathetic in that sense. Looking back at the sloped roof
design, the flat roof works better because the addition can stand out as a
product of its own time. As a suggestion the materials should be restudied
for final. The boxy structure works well and will not be confused with
something that is original on the site.
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Bill Maron said the intent is to be a quiet simple form. The main structure is
a strong basic form.
Brian pointed out that he is comfortable with the 3 foot variance on the west
and the 5 foot on the south. Brian said he appreciates pulling back the
addition to give breathing room for the trail. Jay echoed Brian's comments.
Nora thanked the applicant for all her hard work. The flat roof on the
drawings reads well but on the model the compatibility issues speaks less to
her. The difficulty of the shed roof before was the height. The
compatibility, size and scale are still questionable. Nora said she is also ok
with the 3 and 5 foot variances. The visual impact from the trail side needs
minimized.
Sarah said she is concerned about the height of the addition and how it could
be more sympathetic to the existing structure. Is there any height that can
come out of the addition? If the building is being designated we need to set
a good example of how the expansion is proposed to the chalet. In terms to
our guidelines 10.9 is not the applicable guideline as the building is set apart
from the existing building; however in terms of the scale of the addition
plate heights could be looked at to see how the scale can be brought down
and the link looked at.
Brian said there is no language in the guidelines that prohibits the suggestion
of flat roofs. Possibly the plate height could be reduced 1 '/z feet. Nora said
there is something that is not minimizing the visual impact.
Sarah said we need to see how we can make this project better. I am in
favor of the 5 foot south variance. We have a wall that is closer to a
property line than what is allowed by code. If we could step it and give
more articulation it would help in relationships to the property next door.
Suzanne said that could be part of the conceptual approval, lowering the
ceiling to the roof line of the existing building.
Jay said staff and monitor could approve the change to the roof. What we
have and what this person is trying to do we just need to tweak the design.
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Brian said he is in favor of giving a variance on the west if the roof height is
lowered to the height of the existing chalet as it makes it less imposing to
whatever will be built next door.
MOTION: Jay moved to approve Resolution #1 S, 2009 for 219 S. Third
Street as written by staff with the requirement of the restudy of the addition
roof to be reviewed at final. Sarah second.
Amended motion by Sarah: Clarifications of the restudy: That the addition
roof be restudied in accordance to guideline 10.7 specifically about the
connector to create more of a connector between the addition and the
existing house by lowering the roof and that the overall roof height of the
addition be reduced.
Jay amended Sarah's motion second by Sarah. Motion and amended motion
carried 3-1. Nora opposed.
Nora said she is uncomfortable approving anything without seeing what we
are getting. The south variance is OK but the west is still questionable.
Sarah suggested building sections be submitted at final. We will discuss the
height at the beginning of the meeting for final approval.
Part II -Incentives
Amy said at the last meeting May 13`h resolution #14 was passed in favor of
recommending historic designation and the lot split. That has moved onto
City Council. HPC also expressed an opinion about the benefits that were
being requested. Council is still in the negotiations and they might want
clarity from the HPC on the incentives or requests of the applicant. Amy
said the applicant has chosen the lot split option but they could actually do
two detached houses and condominiumize them and leave them all on one
site. If they did that HPC could give the variances in terms of the setbacks.
As soon as the lot split happens HPC cannot give variances on the site. It is
just the way the program has developed. By doing the lot split affordable
housing comes into play. The applicant is asking City Council for setback
variances on the vacant lot where a new house is being proposed. They are
also asking fora 16.6 variance from the front line as the existing house
currently sits 8 '/z feet back from the front and they are supposed to have a
25 foot setback. The applicant has offered to pay the cash-in-lieu payment.
They are asking that the rate be fixed as of 2009. They took off the 10 year
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vested rights request. Amy said she feels Council is supportive of the lot
split.
Sarah said HPC should discuss the incentives and not the lot split. Suzanne
said she is only concerned about two incentives, the front yard setback and
the 493 square foot bonus which in essence has reduced itself to 213 square
feet due to the calculation. We thought we had 279 additional square feet
available to us which we don't have. If we condominiumized the lot HPC
could grant the setback. If you go back to the 25 foot requirement the
building will have to be a very tall massive front and it is not doable. We
couldn't do the historic lot split and you would have to orient the front yard
to be Third Street and that would push the duplex and carriage house. You
would be ten feet off the alley instead of 8.6 off the alley and it would run
for 70 feet. If you are going to have buildings along that alley anyway I'd
rather see this building saved and just a small portion non-conforming.
Bill Maron said in an urban context it has no street, the alley essentially
becomes the street for that lot. The greater good for the trail users etc. is
holding that line and creating an urban street like phase and giving green
space on the trail easement side rather than the alley.
Suzanne said the 493 square feet is important to us. If we build by right we
can have a single family FAR of 3,652 square feet. In addition you get the
600 square foot bonus for the carriage house that you can sell as an
affordable housing unit. You will also have below grade space of about
3,000 square feet. You will have about 7,152 square feet of heated living
area. The preservation of the duplex has 3,175 of heated area, 1,907 for the
single family home and 1,100 square feet below grade which comes to 6,182
square feet. The difference is around 970 square feet which is a huge
number when you talk about real estate prices in Aspen. We are just trying
to make this work. We would rather preserve the building and have 2,400
square feet for the single family which is not over burdening the historic
resource or neighborhood. The 493 square feet is no significant in the
scheme but it is important to us. At the council meeting they felt they didn't
have enough input from HPC on these two incentives.
Bill Maron pointed out regarding the FAR bonus the Chalet style is not as
commercially viable as a Herbert Bayer. In preserving something of a less
commercial appealing style a little bit of a bonus helps in that effort.
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Suzanne said the merits of preserving a Victorian are very clear. It is not as
clear as to who appreciates the chalet type architecture in today's market.
There are transitional structures that ordinance #48 is seeking to protect. I
believe in 50 years people will have the same kind of economic parody.
There is a risk in protecting transitional structures. It may be that an
additional economic incentive is going to be vital. This is the first project to
come through this process and still be moving forward.
Amy said on a 3,900 square foot R-15 lot the maximum FAR for a single
family is 2,652 square feet before slope reduction.
Jake Vickery said it would be around 2,100 square feet with the slope
reduction.
Vice-chair, Sarah Broughton opened the public hearing.
Paul Young, neighbor - I'm the most impacted neighbor across the alley 413
W. Hopkins. I am the one who said I would rather have what is allowed
than the proposed development. The allowed is with a carriage house and an
ADU. What the applicant is asking for is all free market. I also disagree
with Mr. True. You will end up finding that there will be a legal stance on
the discussion what was pointed out to City Council last night. In my talk
with Cit~ Council last night I went ahead and took how you voted on the
May 13` meeting questioned the size of my home being 3,606 square feet of
FAR. Our lot and my home is larger than the developers newly acquired
property lot area which Ms. Foster is asking 1,383 square feet of FAR above
what is allowed without land marking. This is a 40% increase over what our
family built. 40% more on less lot area. The requested front yard setback
variance is 16.1/2 feet for Lot 2 should not be granted and an approval
should not be given because HPC board members did not approve that at
your meeting. Secondly, because of the city code 26314 does not authorize
this particular variance approval. It should be the developer's responsibility
to make their project work without this major variance being the setback
requirement. I keep hearing it is a deal breaker on the 493 more feet. Why
does it need to be bigger? I pointed out to City Council that the 16 1.2 feet
front yard variance is the single most biggest consideration that I beg you
and also the City Council not to approve. If this property Lot 2 which is
being created it needs a front yard. It needs trees and landscaping and a
place to throw the snow off their driveway. What the model shows in close
proximity the proposal by the applicant shows 25 feet and by pushing it back
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I could live with the variances on the side, could live with all the variances
on the historical property but this is one area I don't think the neighborhood
is getting a fair deal if you grant what you did not approve before on this 16
1.2 foot variance. Since the neighborhood might have to accept the lot split
and the designation that the City through the Council and the HPC would
keep the height, mass and scale of the new structure consistent with the
duplex. That is my position on this.
Jake Vickery - Exhibit I -photograph of the alley. Jake said the alley is
descriptive of what the area looks like. I suggest that you reduce the FAR.
The new building needs to be compatible. On the design of the front
elevations flat roofs should only be in areas of context. We are adamantly
opposed to the front yard setback. It is crowded having the front at 8.6.
Angela Young - 412 W. Hopkins. This alley and safety situations are not
being addressed. If the proposed development is allowed to go forward our
neighborhood will suffer. The proposed project doesn't work for the
neighborhood. With the two variances requested we overwhelming
recommend denial for this project.
List of neighbors opposed -Exhibit II
Junee Kirk - e-mail -Exhibit III
Junee commented that preservation should not be used as a tool for FAR.
Heidi Hoffman -Recommendations to City Council should include re-
evaluation the front yard setback. I don't agree with the contention that it
should line up with the existing duplex especially with the bonus given for
the FAR.
Junee stated that there is a lot of opposition to ordinance #30 and #48.
Jim pointed out that there was no vote taken on Modern Chalet by the task
force.
Junee said in our committee of 8 or 10 two voted for it.
Amy clarified that the task force is an evolving process and there have been
no conclusions. They have broken into small groups that are studying
issues. The criteria committee is the one that is most focused on style and
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which ones merit. They took a vote, 8 in favor, two opposed that Modern
chalets, that there are examples in town that are worthy of preservation. It
wasn't a decision specific to this project.
Junee said it was for exemplary project.
Amy pointed out that the committee has no conclusion; they are still
working on it.
Vice-chair Sarah Broughton closed the public hearing.
Committee discussion on the two incentives: front yard variance and 493
FAR bonus.
Nora said we spent four hours at the last meeting and came up with
conclusions that we wanted to send to City Council and in all due respect my
decision has not changed. The motion was very specific. This is the first
negotiation and it is really important that we have clarity. We need to be
very careful in setting precedence.
Jay said maybe a board members feeling has changed seeing and approving
the conceptual design.
Amy went over the motion from the last meeting, May 13`h 2009.
HPC voted 5-0 to recommend designation and the lot split.
HPC expressed some support for the FAR bonus and support for variances
to legalize the existing structure; setbacks and Residential Design Standards
just to make the situation conforming.
HPC did not support the 493 square foot bonus.
HI'C was divided whether setback variances were appropriate for lot 2.
HPC did not support waiving the ADU mitigation which is off the table.
HPC did not support the vested rights extension which is off the table.
HPC through the Residential Design Standards, primary and secondary mass
for Lot 2 should be determined during the conceptual review.
Jay said his feelings have not changed. I was in favor of the front yard
setback, the alignment to the new project. I am even more inclined to be a
louder voice because of the alterations that were made in order to save this
structure. I am a bit troubled by some of the comments I heard tonight by
the public that the house had no integrity and wasn't worth preserving. And
the second public comment made by the same person said that this ruins the
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integrity of the house and how could you allow this to happen. I keep
hearing contradictory arguments from the public and it confuses me. The
bottom line when it comes down to how I feel, is this house worth
preserving. The commission spoke that it was. I haven't asked the applicant
this question and I am not sure I will but if the second option or the scrape
and replace option is left there, Mick said it best, be careful what you wish
for. What is allowed to be built after that house is scraped is a lot more
detrimental to the neighborhood. A lot more mass and a lot more scale. We
as a commission need to look at all possibilities. I fall back on preservation
of this structure because of its condition and I feel that the incentives should
be used in a proper way to preserve this structure. The addition that the
applicant has proposed is small and sympathetic and seems to be less and
smaller than what we typically see. As far as the 493 square feet, which is
now 213 square feet, Mr. Young, the way I took your comment was that you
don't care what is up there as long as they keep the 25 yard setback. Does
that me he doesn't care if we or council allows the property building
envelope to crowd our public amenity and our protected railroad and the
open space that goes behind there. It concerns me that that would be OK as
long as it is pushed away from the alley. As far as the crowding in the alley
and parking, David Bentley and all the other stuff that was mentioned, in my
opinion the project sitting in front of me would help alleviate a lot of the
randomly parked cars and it would probably clean up that alley which is not
very clean right now. That is why I support the front yard setback and I
support this project for the preservation of this Modern Chalet. If we had the
ability to look at this property without historic task force final conclusion I
can't take comments of here say and am frankly offended by it. To be told
what direction the task force is going is inappropriate. I am not using that as
a reason to approve this project or setback and the square footage for
financial reasons for this project to go forward. I just want that heard, here
say is not appropriate here at all. I would like to see this house preserved
and would give Council my recommendation to use the tools that they have
to legally approve the setback. The bottom line is if they don't approve the
setback and someone scrapes the house you are getting 1.5 feet more of
setback legally that you cannot do anything about. I do not see the benefit
the neighborhood is arguing for so much. I am for the 493 square feet as I
was at the last meeting. My concern is protecting this structure and these
two incentives I find just.
Nora agreed that we are here to preserve structures that we can preserve.
When I look at the incentives that have already come, the historic lot split,
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one FAR bonus and variances on that site, it is a lot. Philosophically I
cannot support another FAR. I don't believe that variances should be used
for private. Variances are there for public use and I don't think they should
be used for private gain. Respectfully, if between 2100 square feet and 2600
square feet if that is the square footage that the property can support maybe
that is how it has to look. There is nothing wrong with small. The numbers
game doesn't guide me, it is the philosophy of what kind of precedence's are
we setting and how do we save something without over burdening
something else, the entire neighborhood and property and if we are really
about preserving something sometimes we have to be more modest in what
we take. I have to go back to the community plan AACP and say we want
neighborhoods with scale. Hopefully something small, modest and discrete
could land there without lots of variances. I know that is not our purview at
this point. I would vote the same way I voted the last time, no on the
variance and no on the FAR.
Brian said both Nora and Jay had good comments. I am more in keeping
with the motion that was crafted the last time. I do feel that this is an
architectural style worth preserving. It is an important era in the
development of this town and an important fabric of this neighborhood as
well as many neighborhoods within Aspen. That is what makes this
neighborhood eclectic and great, the fabric of different architecture and
styles. That said, do I feel that this is an exemplary model of that era, not
necessarily, but I do feel it is something worth preserving. So that weights
in on my view what might be reasonable on incentives to give for the
preservation of this project. One of the things that have always bugged me
was this house's orientation to the street. This is coming from someone who
has a background in landscape architecture. One of the things that have
always concerned me was how that house or any house speaks to the vitality
of the streetscape and unfortunately this particular house really shuts down a
lot of that vitality that should be oriented toward Third Street. Although, I
would like to see this house preserved, my hope is that if this project didn't
go through and something else is built there it would be built at the vitality
or orientation of Third Street which is really lacking in that section of town.
Regarding the alleyway we are looking at this as the front yard and will
continue to act as an alleyway from an aesthetic point and functional point. I
really don't have a problem with the setback variance requested. If you look
at all the other conditions of alleyways throughout the town, especially
through the West End, what is being created here is no different from that.
All the buildings etc. are butted to the alleyway. A building closer to the
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alleyway won't be any different then what people are dealing with
throughout the rest of the town. This is an urban area and those are the
constraints that people deal with in those areas. Despite the fact that you
people are living in a dense situation and a very concentrated situation you
have some of the best open space in the entire town within the media
proximity to you; Shadow Mountain and the trail etc. To allow that
concentration in an area I am not opposed to it. Based on those arguments I
am OK granting a variance in the alleyway; however the incentive to
preserve this is not enough for me to go toward granting the 493 square feet
of additional FAR.
Sarah said she echoes many of the same comments. Given the fact that we
as a commission want to preserve this structure I would be willing to grant a
variance off the alley. Apart of me is interested in making it ten feet so to
give a little relief from the preserved structure and ten feet is what it would
be allowed if it were a side yard setback so we are at least conforming to that
portion of the code. I would be willing to give the variance off the north
side of the property. I think the property should be allowed it's FAR by its
zoned district, by its lot size without an addition FAR bonus. The applicant
has determined the lot line based on the addition and from that you have
determine the lot size and therefore the FAR has been determined by that lot
line.
Susanne Foster, applicant asked what happens if I have 1907 square feet left
over and I can get 2300 square feet. Are you in support of a bonus that
would bring it into that level?
Sarah said she is not in favor of a bonus. She is in favor of the lot being
built to what it is allowed as per the R-15 zone district for the lot size.
Suzanne explained if she has 1907 square feet and after you do the topol and
it ends up to 2300 square feet would you allow the awarding of a bonus of
the extra FAR to bring it up to that number.
Sarah said yes I am willing to allow and discuss the FAR that can be put
onto this lot that is what is allowed by the zone district.
Amy said the fathering parcel is allowed a certain amount of FAR. To keep
it simple let's just say 4,000 square feet. When you do a subdivision it may
end up that each smaller lot is allowed 2500 square feet which would total
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more. Sarah is suggesting that she would be OK with Lot 2 being allowed to
have what a subdivided lot would be allowed to carry with the slope
reduction and normal calculations.
Amy said Jake has suggested it would be around 2100 square feet if you
took into account of the slope reduction. That might mean that the bonus is
in the range of 150 to 200 square feet which might or might not satisfy the
applicant.
Suzanne said she is clear on what her requirements are for the front yard
setback and the 493. You can recommend to council and based on their
decision we will move forward or not.
Sarah recommended since the commission is varied that each of our
comments is submitted to City Council on the topics of the FAR and
setbacks.
Suzanne mentioned to the Young's that the new structure would be under
HPC review. People have come to me after they knew what is going on in
support of the project.
Sarah said the resolution will reference the verbatim minutes.
Jay said council is clear that they are looking for where the HPC stands as a
board. In summary three of us said we would agree on the setback variance
and three said they would not agree on the FAR bonus but for different
reasons.
Jim True, Special Counsel requested a motion to amend the motion of
May13 to clarity individual points of view.
Amy said the draft resolution in front of the board describes HPC support for
historic landmark and lot split. The May 13`h recommendation will be
included. I will include the discussion of May 27`h as Jay stated, three were
in support of the front yard and three were not in favor of the FAR bonus;
however, this will be better defined by the comments that will be specifically
provided to city council.
MOTION.• Brian moved to approve the above recommended motion stated
by Amy; second by Jay. All in favor, motion carried 4-0.
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MOTION: Sarah moved to adjourn; second by Jay. All in favor, motion
carried.
Meeting adjourned at 8:00 p.m.
Kathleen J. Strickland, Chief Deputy Clerk
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