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HomeMy WebLinkAboutminutes.apz.20121120 Regular City Planning & Zoning Meeting — Minutes November 20 2012 Comments 2 Minutes 2 Conflicts of Interest 2 Continued - AVH Aspen Valley Hospital 2 1 Regular City Planning & Zoning Meeting— Minutes November 20 2012 LJ Erspamer opened the regular meeting of the Planning and Zoning Commission in Sister Cities Meeting Room at 4:30. Commissioners present were Cliff Weiss, Stan Gibbs, Jasmine Tygre and LJ Erspamer. Commissioner not present were Keith Goode, Bert Myrin, Jim DeFrancia and Ryan Walterscheid. Staff in attendance were Debbie Quinn, Assistant City Attorney; Jennifer Phelan, Deputy City Community Development Director; Jackie Lothian, Deputy City Clerk. Comments Cliff Weiss stated that he wanted to make sure his fellow commissioners were aware of Ordinance 25 which had first reading about 2 weeks ago and it was about C-1 and CC zoning changes to height and scale. Cliff said he wasn't sure how this came about and staff came up with this draft. Cliff said he would like to have other commissioners present at the process between Council and staff. LJ Erspamer asked if the Council was going to refer to us. Jennifer Phelan said she didn't know but would find out. LJ said that he was kind of shocked about the whole process and their thoughts on this and that we haven't been asked. Jasmine Tygre agreed with U. Cliff said that he met with Bert for about 2 hours so when we get together next week so we understand it. LJ said he spoke to Bert and said it would be better to deal with 3 or 4 issues than all of them. Cliff said there were about 40 of these and they will prioritize. Debbie Quinn said that she has been working on the procedural resolution for your consideration dealing with requests for recusal and she will provide a draft at the next regular meeting. MOTION: Stan Gibbs moved to approve the minutes from October 161h with a change to page 9 "extend" seconded by Cliff Weiss seconded. All in favor, APPROVED. MOTION: Cliff Weiss moved to approve the minutes from October 301h seconded by Jasmine Tygre. All in favor, APPROVED. Disclosure of Conflicts of Interest LJ Erspamer disclosed that he participated in the sale of the Beaumont Inn. Continued Public Hearing: AVH Aspen Valley Hospital LJ Erspamer opened the continued public hearing. Jennifer Phelan stated this was a continued public hearing of the Hospital's Master Facility Plan and review of Phases III and IV; we have multiple meetings for this case and the last meeting was 2 Regular City Planning & Zoning Meeting — Minutes November 20 2012 on October 30th. Jennifer said that they discussed the history and overview of Phases III and IV and tonight they would have continued discussion highlighting some of the conditions of Conceptual approval and Phase II final approval. The applicant will discuss mechanical issues, the roof and what they are doing with the mechanical, floor plan changes and some of the decompression issues that the brought up quite awhile ago in other reviews, discussing lighting of the site, the loop service road, landscaping, and a master facilities review. Jennifer said there was another meeting on December 4th and if we need more meetings we can look into January; on December 4th we will be talking about sound; the review criteria for phases III and IV. Jennifer said a draft resolution will be included and continued discussion. Jennifer said for the record we had a site visit on November 13th in which planning members, the city attorney and herself attended to look at the outdoor lighting at night. Jennifer added Exhibit G which was an email from Jim DeFrancia on lighting recommendations based on the site visit. Jennifer said that Phase II was approved in 2010; construction is under way. The conceptual approval had a number of requirements associated with it and that approval was granted in 2009; there were elevations of the proposal, there was some discussion about affordable housing but there were no plans developed at the time. Jennifer said there were a number of revisions and considerations that were requested as part of the conceptual approval. The statement that regards to the overall building size, use and architecture design the city council felt at the time that the massing and scale was appropriate for the site and the proposed uses; there were concerns about the parking garage aesthetics to minimize the whole impact and the proposed materials and architecture was appropriate for the site. Jennifer said in her memo she talked about some of the changes of size of the project and what you will see the approximate square footage is approximately the same as what was approved conceptually within 5%. Most of that square footage is in the basement and they will be talking about their plans and how those have changed. There was discussion about Green Technology in the project; Phase II is going for LEED certification; there is an emphasis on Transit that was approved in Phase II. Jennifer said that a lot of the things that got brought up in the conceptual approval have actually been incorporated in the current construction phase. For example the Nordic Trail location, neighbors were involved in working with the applicant and our Parks Department for finding a location for some of the trail drainage and snow storage was handled during Phase II; the drainage plan was approved by the 3 Regular City Planning & Zoning Meeting — Minutes November 20 2012 City Engineer and there will be some slight modifications due to some changes in III and IV but overall the drainage has been approved for the site. The bus stop and those improvements are occurring during Phase II so there were quite a few things approved in the previous Phase and that is under construction currently. The lighting in the Ordinance from Phase 11 said that they would meet our outdoor lighting standards. Jennifer said she noted in the memo outdoor lighting is the only part that we regulate; we do not regulate lighting in the building so with regard to lighting the hospital has actually regulated itself to a higher degree with regard to lighting than what our code requires. They have the automatic shades that are on the upper story of the development. Clearly there was some neighborhood concern with the installed lighting and the applicant is working on remedying some of those issues and it is ongoing. Landscaping was improved and was going to be field inspected and additional planting are being proposed for III and IV. Jennifer said for tonight the commission should delve into lighting in more detail; what are your concerns about it; what do you think is working and what is not working on the site. Jennifer said landscaping may be talking about areas that might need more softening with landscaping would be a good thing to highlight and we will see what the applicant is proposing. Jennifer said they should talk about where does some of this new mechanical go for Phases III and IV; what has changed from conceptual; they are proposing now and to respond to concern they may have heard concerns from the neighbors and how can that be minimized after we have this discussion maybe some direction for the applicant for the December 4th hearing. LJ said that he had a question on outside lighting which is the only thing that we have control over and but if you have an inside light projecting outside with such brightness doesn't that change to outside lighting. Jennifer responded no, our code regulates fixture that are fixed to the outside of a building. Jennifer said part of the discussion is interior lighting because the applicant has gone beyond what our code requires because we don't regulate interior lighting and the indoor blinds on the upper story on the hospital I think will show how they have minimized light trespass at night outside. LJ asked if we were discussing mass and scale and height tonight. Jennifer replied we will see where we get with and raise those questions that you have. Dave Ressler, CEO, thanked the commissioners and staff for coming out to the hospital for that meeting. Dave said they would address a number of issues that were raised at the last meeting and we are looking for you direction to make this project be allowed to go forward. Dave said they would talk about the grade and building height as well as the rooftop mechanicals and then get to lighting. Dave 4 Regular City Planning & Zoning Meeting— Minutes November 20 2012 said they heard the community and have been acting on this for months and it did not just surface at the last P&Z Meeting. Dave said when the design of the lighting was constructed and the engineers had the best of intentions to have this be a very energy efficient lighting and it had LEED so there was a second object that you can't minimize we have to have a safe campus, we are a 24/7 operation; we have to be cognizant the we have to have the public and staff safety and energy efficiency were the good intentions but had unintentional consequences that we apologize for and we are putting a lot of energy toward it. Dave said they have to take a whole different approach to the lighting than it was originally designed; it is a complete rebalancing of trying to maintain the safety and energy efficiency and taking into account aesthetic conditions. Dave said that Russ will explain that he has brought in a consultant with the experience to address this but with the construction new lights go up every day and we are catching up and will make it right. Dave said that Jason would discuss how we use the loop road and any impacts it might have and some landscaping. Russ Sedmak said his presentation utilizing power point showed specific grades; the detail plan and the dark lines are identification of section cuts showed the berm along the Meadowood side, the Ambulance Barn and the floor elevations of the building and rooftop features. Russ said Section AA (on page 12 of the memo) is looking due north through the existing berm, the trees are approximately what they show and the highest one is about 15 feet above the elevation of the existing parking lot that will become the elevation of the loop road on that side; the loop road is up against that retaining wall. The ambulance barn is buried about 5 or 6 feet stick up above that grade and there will be landscaping to soften that and a green roof on top of that ambulance garage and it is lower in elevation than Meadowood Drive itself. Section BB (on page 12) is looking towards the northwest through the ambulance barn and is out of the picture before it gets to Twin Ridge that driveway elevation in front of the garage has to be maintained because the road needs to be there to access it and they are stepping down the ambulance ramp by about another 121/2 feet. Russ said the pad for the helicopter is slightly higher than the loop elevation but it is not a full story above that; the helipad is above ground which make it a safer condition and low enough to be below the treetops. 5 Regular City Planning & Zoning Meeting— Minutes November 20 2012 Russ said the view from Meadowood Drive was minimal for the air handling unit and they are trying to mitigate for that unit. Section BB was by the entrance and shows the roof lobby at about 21 feet above the ground. Russ said the mechanical will be provided as back up and the relate heights to the roof. This area serves the patient care unit and requires a lot of air exchanges and filtration; the other floor is the second floor with the PT Department and the Aspen Orthopedics space and is approximately 11 feet above the roof elevation. The units are 21/2 feet lower than the other ones and are under the Phase I1 expansion. The beige units are being replaced and the one unit will go away; the replacement units will range from 8 feet to 91/2 feet above the roof and the blue boxes here are the same unit location so they can reuse the same duct work. The only unit you will see as part of the Phase III project that is above the roof because this one needs to be on the roof of the medical office space because it would be terribly inefficient to put that air handling unit in the basement. Russ showed a drawing of the unit that were in the basement with the scale and one serves the surgery department directly above this space, one serves the imaging department directly above the space, and the smaller one serves the emergency department. This is a considerable improvement from the conceptual design; this allows us to hide this equipment completely underground and allow us to maintain it better and the equipment will operate efficiently fora longer period of time. They have added about 8,000 square feet to the building to contain the service area and mechanical. Russ said there were 4 problem areas that they were dealing with on lighting with respect to Phase II. The first on and probably the most server because we haven't fully figured it out yet is the area in front of Whitcomb Terrace and the north end of the parking structure, the second one is the loop road that goes all the way around the back of the building, the third one is yhe top of the parking deck itself and the fourth one is the surface parking lot. After you came out and did a tour we have continued to make some further mitigation where we had the neighbors come out on Thursday and appreciate them coming out and walking around in the cold with us and we felt with their feedback it was productive. Dave said the first thing that they were trying to address was the parking garage; it was quite bright with angles downhill from the hospital. Dave said as a temporary measure they put up that screening. Russ said they were having consulting associates from Boulder that are pretty well known for aesthetic lighting and light mitigation as well as technical solutions. Russ showed the temporary construction cloth and the mesh that will be installed you can see through and how effective it is for the solution to the neighbors and they liked the color and effectiveness of that screening. 6 Regular City Planning & Zoning Meeting — Minutes November 20 2012 Russ said the secondary that they looked at was the loop road with light poles planned along the service drive in the back of the building and have decided since it is a service drive that will be used pretty sparingly that we can mitigate by putting in bollards that have 180 degree lenses. Once that the bollards are installed we will have the neighbors come back out to see them working to confirm that we have solved that problem. Russ said the LED lights that they put up and in the top of the garage they have disconnected the middle light in the bollards so we have eliminated 33% of the illumination from the lights on the poles even at their maximum usage and demonstrated to the neighbors because they had a pole on top of the deck and a light pole in the parking lot that had not been adjusted and demonstrated that we actually need to do that for the parking lot. Russ said they didn't think that they could put the lights on the parking lot on motion sensors like what we did for the top deck because that surface lot will be used more readily at night than the parking deck and there will be a one way gate at night for people who have parked there during the day for them to get out but if nobody is up there for more than 2 minutes the lights go out. Russ said another area of concern was the lobby itself seeing brightly and some of those lights are being taken out and the chandlers turn off after dark so the lights that are on at night to navigate and mitigate at night. Jason said the loop road is not a change from what had been proposed in the conceptual application. The loop road serves 3 purposes: emergency access for the fire department, the ambulance egress from the ambulance barn and the service function of bringing goods and linens and supplies to the hospital. In Phase III a second service dock will be added on the west side of the ambulance ramp. The service uses will arrive at the north entry. The new dock on the west end in Phase III is specifically related to supplies stored off site and the trucks operate during daylight hours. The loop road will be signed as service. Jason talked about the overall landscape plan is divided into zones and in the more intense zone you will see more decorative plantings and those are all around the entries to the hospital building in Phase II and III and as it progressively towards the edges of the property it transitions to a native landscape to achieve a number of goals. We are trying to create an extensive planting plan and one that is not burdensome to the hospital. Jason said that they were also seeking LEED certification the Second Phase and native plants also helps to blend into the existing landscape. The gamble oaks are very old and the wall is very specific to the preservation of those trees. There are about 200 feet of Cottonwoods that they will preserve. Jason said another goal of the master plan is to provide screening where possible to take advantage of both grades and soften; we know that we can't 7 Regular City Planning & Zoning Meeting— Minutes November 20 2012 make the hospital disappear but we want to take advantage of every opportunity to soften the views to the hospital from off site. Jason said they are working under pretty complex parameters; one was with the Parks Department who look at things like species and the long term viability of the plants and once we get through that approval we are at a density, there are engineering constraints is the sight triangle that identifies the existing hospital is deficient in the distance that you can see up and down Castle Creek Road when you are coming in and out of the hospital. Jason said another site constraint is with easements on the site; a water line main that runs the entire length on the east property and it is 25 feet off of the right of way and they are not allowed to plant any trees or large shrubs in that water line easement. As the landscape is installed there are a huge number of plants from Phase II that will not go in until the spring of 2013. There are still 120 trees to be planted around the parking garage and larger trees. Dave re-emphasized this was a phased project and being a good neighbor is their intent. Dave said he hoped that you would allow us to bring the whole project to fruition. We have had a community advisory committee in place since 2006 and the neighborhood outreach is more intensive with 3 meetings every month for our neighbors and it is the first Monday night every month. And they have a monthly meeting with Whitcomb Terrace and the Senior Center and monthly meetings with the Meadowood Homeowners Association. Dave said they have a feedback manager, Frank Goldsmith. LJ stated that they will take a break and come back with the commissioner comments and then the public comments. Gideon Kaufman asked if they could have the citizen comments before the Commissioner Comments. Jasmine noted that was not following procedure. LJ said that sometimes we answer your questions but in the nature of things we will let the public comment first. Public Comments: 1. Bud Glissman stated that he joined the staff at Aspen Valley Hospital in 1984 and was the founder of the group that staff's the emergency room. Bud said that he has turned the emergency room into one that everybody trusts and feels comfortable bringing their medical problems knowing that they are going to get high quality competent care in a comfortable environment; the environment part is becoming difficult because this emergency department was designed and built before emergency rooms had a substance. It is too small, there is no privacy, there are not enough exam rooms, not enough procedure rooms, it is cramped, there is no proper nursing station layout. It is inadequate and it is time to upgrade. Bud said this is about the community 8 Regular City Planning & Zoning Meeting —Minutes November 20 2012 and he is sensitive to light pollution and the hospital is well put together. This may impact some people but the bottom line is the welfare of the community. 2. Kathleen Hagerty said that she knew a lot of people benefited from their services at the hospital and they do need more space back in surgery, we are expanding our services, our clinics, and serve the community so you don't have to go down valley. We need more room for our technology and privacy. 3. King Woodward stated that he lives in Meadowood and there are a number of people working with the hospital through Frank going to the Monday meetings at the first of the month and the lighting has been addressed. King said they have done a spectacular job. King said P&Z does an excellent job and he was on P&Z in 1965 when the first master plan was done. LJ closed the public comments portion of the hearing. Commissioner Questions: Cliff Weiss asked the code height for a mechanical unit on a roof top; he said that he though 10 foot was code. Jennifer responded that this is a PUD and during Phase II we developed a mechanical plan. Cliff asked what kind of noise and a visual of what these units will make and he wanted to know the color of some of the larger units. Russ replied as far as the air handling units go we can produce some visuals so we can see what they will look like in the context of the various views. Cliff asked if every mechanical unit was on the model at AVH. Russ replied that because the scale was so small it was hard to get it down to the foot and inch but he suggested they re-present photo-shop of the perspective shots of the building with the color and size of the units. LJ asked about the decibels and noise. Russ answered they would have them at the December 4th meeting. Cliff asked what would be planted in front of the building. Russ replied that Sheet L102 which is in exhibit appendix is on the west boundary and they are Aspen trees and Blue Spruce in an even base. Cliff asked where the water line that was-preventing you for putting up a certain amount of screening. Russ answered that it runs all the way along the eastern property boundary and you will see larger plants in one area and a lot are yet to be planted. Russ said there were existing cottonwoods on the water line easement and if we were to cut them down they would not be able to be put back on that easement. Cliff asked when will we get a basic recommendation on the lighting. Russ replied they will be getting recommendations on the Phase II project before that next meeting the final outcome but they will not be done with all of the design finished for Phases III and IV to a level where we can bring renderings of what that will look like. 9 Regular City Planning & Zoning Meeting — Minutes November 20 2012 Stan Gibbs asked about a comment made at the site visit about automatic shades couldn't be in the patient rooms and he asked why it could be done in a PT room but not in a patient room. Russ replied the windows in the patient rooms do have full blackout shades as well as the translucent screens and we feel it is inappropriate to force the window shades to be drawn in a room that is occupied by patients sometime 24 hours a day; it gives them control over their environment. Stan said there was ice from the loading dock and going up to the building on our tour; do you have a plan for controlling ice. Russ replied that at times we might have to have a chemical or salt treatment; once the hospital is completed they will be able to manage the winter months better than with all the construction going on. Stan asked if we were talking about transportation in the future or now, not just RFTA but pedestrian. Jennifer there was a transportation demand traffic plan or are you looking at how people are going to move through this site. Stan replied yes because he has had some experience that has just changed. Stan asked if the RFTA buses are going to be able to drop off at the Phase IV entry. Russ answered the design of the building is designed to allow that turning to take place by a specific request by a passenger to go there and be dropped at that location. Stan said when he was trying to come from the bus there was a section of the pedestrian path that just stopped before the front door and he could see that people were walking through an unmarked area. Stan asked if they had plans to continue the outreach ongoing. Dave said just like they are continuing the outreach for Phase II they will do it all the way through the construction and the stopping point would be when construction is done with Phases III and IV. LJ said Stan noted a dangerous situation and asked Russ if they will bring a solution to the pedestrian situation in that are from the hospital to the bus stop. Jason said that they could fix that. LJ asked about the ambulance back up noise, the beepers and how would that be handled. Gideon said it was a circular drive. Dave said there will be no backing outside of the garage. LJ asked if there would be an exhaust fan to clear out the exhaust. Dave replied yes. LJ asked the grade in BB; he asked Jennifer how you measure height when you start with height; does the height of the building start from the upper grade or the lower grade. Jennifer said at the parameter of the building you measure up; so it is either natural or finished whichever is more restrictive. Jennifer said in Phase II they did a roof plan showing the elevations from finished grade so that it was easier to know how high a certain feature of the building was. LJ asked Jennifer if she found the answer to Cliff's question regarding the mechanical. Jennifer responded that it was 5 feet above the height of the building at the point that it is attached and it is supposed to be 20 feet back from the perimeter of the building. LJ asked if it met that. Russ replied no because it is a PUD. LJ asked if you can make that 10 Regular City Planning & Zoning Meeting— Minutes November 20 2012 mechanical more horizontal rather than vertical at I I V2 feet. Russ said that they have already optimized the dimensions and made the heights of them as low as possible but the size of the fans that circulate dictate the height. LJ asked if the fans were vertical or horizontal. Russ replied they were vertical, the shafts were horizontal and the blades are vertical and they blow air through the unit. LJ asked why can't you put horizontal ones on there. Russ replied that they don't make them that way; they blow the air through filters and duct work horizontally. Russ said they have to go through sequences and steps. LJ asked where the back-up generator was located. Russ answered it was basically between the boiler room and the berm. LJ asked why didn't you put more mechanical in the basement. Russ responded they put all of the air handling in the basement that we could based on the location of the basement and they can't build a basement under the existing one story building. LJ asked what was the purpose of having glass and light up to the second floor at the current entrance now. Russ stated it was a 2 story space with a balcony in it and the windows provide natural light into the space reducing energy consumption providing views to the outside, it is an amenity. LJ asked if we were discussing the new entrance. Russ replied yes. Jennifer said it was Phase IV. LJ asked what height was that going to be with all that glass. Russ said the height was just under 20 feet and will be a little lower than the Phase II entrance because the Phase II is a full 2 story building; the majority of the Phase IV lobby is really just a high lobby space with a portion that will be 2 story. Russ said that he would bring the illustration to the next meeting. LJ asked if you have to evacuate the patients in the building what kind of system do you have. Dave asked if you mean like an internal disaster. LJ replied yes. Dave stated there were plans in place which involves ambulance evacuation; if we need to evacuate the entire building we have current plans that you go out the emergency entrance and take the patients to the ambulances. LJ said that egress is very steep how are you going to keep snow and ice off that egress. Russ said that area will have snowmelt in it. Commissioner Comments: Cliff said they need a sidewalk from HHR when you get off the bus, there is no place to walk, you are in the middle of the street. Dave asked if it was the intent to cross where it does exist today and you have a crosswalk all the way across. Dave said the stretch that Stan was talking about was not completed, that sidewalk will go all the way around. Stan said it isn't that the sidewalk isn't there it is that people don't necessarily go where the sidewalks are placed people will go where they want to go not where you want them to go as a planner. Stan said that he crossed the street and came to this corner of the parking lot 3 feet away and he 11 Regular City Planning & Zoning Meeting— Minutes November 20 2012 could see footprints where there were going to be plantings or even if you plant a fir tree people are going to go through there and tear it down and they are going to walk into a parking lot which is not necessarily what you want them to do. Stan said he didn't know what the right solution was but human nature being what it is; it got to be an obvious thing. Stan said now that he knows this is there is no sign there. Dave said what you (Stan) are saying if you are coming out of the HHS building there is no sidewalk, people are going to walk and they do walk alongside the hill now. Cliff said you have a lot of LED lights and he understands how efficient they are and understands how sensitive you are to the neighbors. Cliff said that he was sensitive to the light and the LED lights unless shrouded are very bright. Cliff thought the mesh was okay but he wanted them to continue to look at that. Cliff said shrouding the lamps inside with those boxes was almost too much; he didn't know if bollards were the answer to keeping the light from going down and not out sideways. There are a lot of solutions out there that will help you not with just the rooms but with your entrances; you are going to build a really big glass wall facing south and I heard some concerns about that from the neighbors about that and he happens to like that design but a window tinting film might be a solution for that entrance as well as the ortho entrance. Cliff said the fixture right over the door was very bright and cast in all directions. Cliff said as far as the rooftop mechanical he needs something that tells him where and what can we do to mitigate it as best as possible. Cliff said back to the mesh and maybe by working on the lights it will eliminate his concern about the mesh. Cliff said he was concerned about the affordable housing that will in some ways screen the hospital but maybe you can learn from the hospital and it will be a problem of its own. LJ said Cliff was right about the lights being too bright even though they are inside. Jasmine said the things that she wanted to talk about are not covered today. Gideon asked if there were some things that we can finish with continuity Cliff said the applicant expressed that to some degree it is a learning curve that is happening even while it is under construction. So we are reacting the same way you are; it is a work in progress. Cliff said he was supportive and give the neighborhoods as much mitigation from light pollution as we can and sound pollution. 12 Regular City Planning & Zoning Meeting — Minutes November 20 2012 MOTION: Stan Gibbs moved to extend the meeting by 10 minutes; seconded by Cliff Weiss. 3 in favor I opposed. U said this building is beautiful and great in a big city; we are in a small city. U said we need this building to look smaller; this is the situation is to make it smaller. The second story and the new entrance with the curve will be hidden by trees. U said that the lights are too bright and he was concerned about the grade and it will change when you put the townhomes in; work on the mesh but you need to deal with the lights. U asked where more softening was needed with landscaping. In reference to HVAC U said he thinks you can make it more horizontal than vertical. MOTION: Stan Gibbs moved to continue to December 4`h; seconded by Jasmine. All in favor, APPROVED. Adjourned at 7:20 pm. ckie Lothian, Deputy City Clerk 13