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RECORD-OF- PROCIlBDIlIGS
REGULAR -lIBft:I1IG ----PIAlftUIIG -MII)-ZOR-11IG" -CmUflSSYOIIl--n-wARCR--:l8-. --1986
Chai rman Welton Anderson called the meeting to order at 5: 03
P.M. with Commissioners Mari Peyton, Jasmine Tygre, Roger Hunt,
Jim Colombo, Al Blomquist, and David white (arrived late) present.
COIIM:ISS-I-mlBltS. COIIIIZIrfS
Hunt said he would like to request the Planning Office to develop
a resolution encouraging City Council to do a study on the
aerobus as a form of transportation. Blomquist suggested including
RFTA. Tom Baker, planner, said he had talked with the consultants
and they expressed interest in looking over each other shoulders
to get 2 sides of the same picture.
MOtionl
Hunt moved to direct the Planning Office to come up with a
Resolution to City Council encouraging a study of the aerobus as
a form of transportation; Blomquist seconded. All in favor;
motion carried.
Hunt commented that the Aspen Grove building had added a restaurant
to the second floor. The restaurant has no service access
through the alley, the only access being the front stairway. Hunt
said this causes delivery trucks to double park in the street or
at the corner of the mall. Hunt thought the use tables should be
modified to indicate that restaurants in the CC zone must have
direct access to the alley or an approved service/utility access.
Motion:
Hunt moved to direct the Planning Office to come up with a code
or use table change, at their earliest capability, addressing
restaurants in the CC zone having direct alley or approved
service/utility access; Blomquist seconded. All in favor; motion
carried.
Anderson commented that there were people, calling themselves the
Roaring Fork Railroad Company, interested in working with Rio
Grande Railroad to restablish train service between Aspen and
Denver. They will be meeting wi th City Council, the Board of County
Commissioners, and the Pitkin County Planning and Zoning Commission
next week to discuss their intents. Anderson asked if any of the
Commissioners wanted to participate in those study sessions,
however, he would prefer to have a special presentation for this
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Commission. Blomquist asked if it could be combined with the
staff work being done on transportation and downtown land use.
Alan Richman, Planning Director, said they did not have anything
prepared at this time. The Commission agreed to hold a special
session to discuss the Roaring Fork Railroad Company on March 25,
1986 at 5:00 P.M.
PLAlO1:rBG--oWICB --cmuunr.rs
Richman said they needed to schedule a work session for April I,
1986 to review a draft Historic Preservation Element. Hopefully
it could be recommended to Council, at that time, for endorsement.
The Commission agreed.
Richman commented that he had submitted a letter to the represen-
tatives of the 601 Aspen St. Residential GMP project. As a
result of City Council's determination regarding Ordinance 186-2
.Employee Housing Code Amendments. it is appropriate for that
application to be reviewed. The applicant has been given 2 weeks
to submit a clarified application.
Anderson read a letter from Spencer Schiffer concerning condition
120 of the Little Nell Base Redevelopment Application, contesting
the fact that this Commission moved that the condition had been
met.
MYhu:o;.I!:S
March -1-):- .-l9861
Hunt moved to table approval of the minutes of March II, 1986;
Tygre seconded. All in favor; motion carried.
1i1'l"l'liE-lULli- BASE-.R.....vtd,OPlllllft' -usoL-u'.l':IOlI
Secti-orr-3r-Condition---t:t: Richman asked for comments on the skier
drop-off condition. Hunt said he thought this was the fatal flaw
of the enitre project. The area is not properly designed. Jay
Hammond, City Engineer, said his concern related to 3 separate
curb cuts on Durant St., two of which are very close together
causing a potential for conflict in the street at that point.
The applicants were concerned that if the two curb cuts were
combined you end up with an additional conflict within the
property. Hammond said that would be a much lower speed conflict
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and the impacts relative to the street were lessened. Hammond
said he remained unconvinced that 3 curb cuts were better than 2
cuts. Mr. Kane sa id the def ined landscape island between the
skier drop-off and the hotel drop-off was what created the 3
curb cuts. Mr. Kane said it could be redesigned.
Richman said he was not suggesting any change to the condition.
The condition, as it reads, provides for the opportunity of this
type of negotiation to continue. Richman did think it was
important for Mr. Hammond's memorandum dated March 3, 1986,
dealing with the question of parking and circulation, to be noted.
Hunt said the design he had seen showed extensions on each side of
the parallel parking out in to the right of way, which would be
impossible for street clearing. Hunt had a problem with the
utilization of the right of way and what it wouls do to the flow
of traffic on Durant Ave., given there would be higher numbers
utilizing that area. Hunt said he did not think it was appropriate
to forward this on to Council because it would not be what the
Commission thought it had approved. White agreed. Blomquist
remarked that the City Engineer has control of curb cuts, therefore,
details beyond what has been generated here belong to the Ci ty
Engineer. Blomquist thought the condition should remain as written.
Conditron-t-2~ White asked if the applicant had to go before any
other Boards or Commissions for approval of this condition. The
wording was not very specific as to what would be done, only that
it would be done. Richman said the applicant had committed to
improvements. Mr. Forsch remarked that the improvements would be
in conjunction with either the Special Improvement District or the
Commercial Core and Lodging Commission. White asked if the city
had an adopted plan. Blomquist replied yes. White then asked if
that plan should not be included as part of this condition.
Gideon Kaufman, applicant's attorney, said the adopted plan could
be changed by the Improvement District or any number of others
and they did not want to be tied to something they could not
maintain.
Conditiun~3~ There were no comments.
Condition --<<~ Richman said he thought this condition met with
all of the items discussed and that a plan had been submitted. Hunt
asked if this included the allowance for adding some of the lost
park space in another location, as necessary? Richman said to
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the best of his knowledge the cul-de-sac only uses the area on
the 30 foot easement, therefore, it would not be taking any park
space away. Hunt then asked if the plan worked without taking
some of that park space. Mr. Forsch replied the cul-de-sac would
be to the east of the park space. Mr. Forsch added that park space
would only be used for an extra large truck that might need the
extra space to back out of the service dock. Hunt asked if
ambulance access would also be through the park space. Mr. Forsch
replied yes.
Conditimr--t5-: There were no comments.
Conditt-on---ff-: Richman said he thought the word "graded" in the
second sentence should be changed to read "defined" if acceptable
to the Commission. Richman also commented that the last sentence
of the condition had not been discussed. The issue came across
with the recently adopted Trails Master Plan which shows a nordic
trail crossing the ski area on the Little Nell run. Richman said
he had discussed the matter with the planners involved in the
master plan and with the Aspen Nordic Council and the language of
the last sentence was what was derived from those conversations.
The applicant was concerned that the trail in no way interfer with
the ability for alpine skiing. The Planning Office wants to be
certain that alpine skiing would not prohibit nordic skiing.
Hunt asked if the nordic trail followed a contour. Richman
replied the trail was about at the 8100 level and follows a
contour. Hunt asked if there would be a horizontal hump or if
the grade would just be traversed. Mr. Forsch responded the
nordic skiers would traverse the grade. Richman said language
would probably be added to the end of the condition "provided
that the trail is designed to not interfer with the alpine
skiing". Mr. Forsch said the trail could not be a set track
across the slope and thought there should be appropriate signage
on the nordic trails, warning of uphill skiers etc.
White thought the trail easement should be the Nordic Council's
in the winter and the City's in the summer and questioned the
legality of that possibility. Paul Taddune, City Attorney, said
theoretically the City was going to assume responsibility and
ownership of the trail system, therefore, the easement should be
the City's.
Richman proposed the following language at the close of the
condi tion; "provided that the trail design and maintenance will
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not interfer with needs of the alpine skiing area". The Commission
agreed.
Conditi-on-t71 Hunt said he did not consider the trench for the
gondola a very attractive package and would like to see some
latitude in the language of the condition for the applicant to
investigate other alternatives. Mr. Forsch said they would be
receptive to the language. Blomquist said he understood the
trench was critical and very important to the water storage
capability of the site. Blomquist thought to better address
Hunt's comments the amendment should be made in the first sentence,
amending it to read: "the applicant shall provide detailed
drawings of the proposed gondola terminal building and a landscape
plan to City Council". Blomquist said his assumption of a
little landscaping around the trench, plus fencing, would create
a mountainside environment and would also allow the applicant to
maintain their drainage problem solution. Peyton asked how long
the trench would be. Mr. Kane replied approximately 90 feet.
The Commission agreed to amend the condition, adding the wording
"and a landscape plan" to the first sentence of condition '7.
Condrtiunu-t-8: Blomquist said he thought the last sentence of the
condition should at the least say the "revegitation shall exceed
Forest Service standards" and he questioned if the sentence
should even be included in the condition. Richman commented that
the previous sentence addressed the concerns dealing with the
hotel portion of the landscaping.
Condition--1-!!: Hunt questioned if Hunter St. should not be
included in this condition. Richman replied no, there is no
requirement for Hunter St.
Contti-ti-on--t-Ie-: Mr. For sch asked that they be allowed to use
either that site or an approximate location within a reasonable
distance. Richman said he would not have a problem with that
amendment. Colombo said if the applicant is given that kind of
flexibility shouldn't there be something that guarantees the
number of parking spaces. Richman said 30 spaces were required
and that could be included in this condition. Tygre said she
thought there should also be a definition as to what approximate
is. The Commission agreed to a 300 foot radius proximity.
Conditimr-'ll-: Hunt suggested the word "recommendations" in the
first sentence be changed to "directives, guidelines or requirem-
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ents". Anderson said he thought that was covered in the current
wording.
Conditiurr-t-12~ Mr. Forsch said the language of this condition was
very scary. The applicant has agreed, and continues to agree, to
participate in any studies of geologic hazard and mud flows on
Aspen Mountain. But, up to this point they have been under the
impression that mitigation measures on Little Nell was what was
being considered. Now the applicant is being asked to mitigate
those measures on all of Aspen Mountain, which is something they
are unable and unwilling to do. Richman said the language of the
condition says paTticl~l~. Mr. Forsch said they were certainly
willing to participate but were concerned that the participation
in the mitigation was an open ended commitment that is virtually
impossible for the applicant to make.
Richman said he thought it was crucial, if a major development is
allowed at the base area of Aspen Mountain, that the City feel
comfortable that they have a participant/partner in the mitigation
of the geologic hazards, whose extent at this point is unsure.
It is crucial, given the fact that the Aspen Skiing Company is
the major owner by leasehold under interest in the upslope areas,
that the Ci ty have their participation and partnership. Mr. Kaufman
said they were not saying they would not participate in taking on
any mitigation aspect that developed because of the work at
Little Nell or the hotel. Mr. Kaufman thought it became unfair
with the next step, saying they have to have an unlimited partici-
pation in areas on the mountain that have no impact on the
Little Nell area but rather on other parts of the mountain. The
applicant was willing to commit to participation in the studies
but not to participation that has absolutely nothing to do with
the Little Nell site or project.
Blomquist thought the condition should remain as written because
it does not specify the degree of participation. This project is
viewed as an overall upslope area responsibility, which Blomquist
felt was legitimate, given the fact that the project is built as
the gateway to the mountain. Blomquist felt it was not an
unreasonable requirement. Mr. Forsch agreed and said they would
be willing to participate. Mr. Richman said studies of the
hazard would result in a formula of participation.
Jay Hammond, City Engineer, said Mr. Kaufman's statement would be
true if the Little Nell project stood alone, however, this applicant
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owns or controls a significant portion of the upslope areas of
the mountain. Mr. Hammond said that was the basis of his concern.
Conditt-orr--tl-3-: Richman said he would like to add the language
"consistant with Ray Cassin's report" to the condition.
Hunt asked who was responsible for reconstructing the road "at the
applicant's request" as stated in the condition. Richman replied
that it should read "at the applicant's ~x",en5e".
Blomquist said the condition construes the Aspen Mountain road as
a county road within the city limits. Blomquist asked if it
should not be a city street or trail since it is within the city
limits. Paul Taddune, City Attorney, replied there were provisions
in the Colorado statutes that provide for county roads in municip-
alities. Those situations are where the county road came in to
existance not as a dedicated right of way but as a piece of
property that was conveyed fee simple to the county. When the
municipality annexed there was no consideration paid to having
the county transfer title to the City. Mr. Hammond agreed and
said this particular road had been maintained by the County on
their inventory through the project as it is in its present
location. Blomquist asked if it would not be proper to ask that
a platt be filed on all of the property encompassed within this
project. Blomquist did not feel the road should be a county road
because it is within the City limits. He suggested a manner to
clean this up would be to file a recorded platt. Anderson asked
how much of the road Blomquist was proposing to be included.
Mr. Blomquist said that would have to be studied as part of the
platting process. Anderson said the SPA boundry was what should
be platted, Richman added that the Aspen Mountain road was no
where near the SPA boundry. Richman said he felt what Blomquist
was requesting was not in the purview of this applicantion.
Blomquist said in the platting process this applicant could
establish title to the Aspen Mountain road, and it is within the
City limits. Blomquist did not know a more appropriate time to
clarify this matter.
White commented that the applicant would be regrading the hillside
which would include a plan. Anderson replied that the regrading
plan would be part of the Aspen Mountain Master Plan rather than
the Little Nell base redevelopment. Richman said it would be in
this Commission's purview in 8040 Greenline review.
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lIotion1
Blomquist moved that condition 113 be replaced and require that
the area be platted and that all of the open space be declared
for publ ic open space purpose for alpine skiing in winter and
pristene meadows in summer; White seconded.
DtscU-s-sTom
Mr. Kaufman commented that this requirement entailed more than
had ever been discussed. Mr. Kaufman thought the ownership of
the road was something that was appropriate for discussion
between the City and Pitkin County. Platting has nothing to do
with the ownership question, this is an SPA with a limited
boundry and platting has nothing to do with the SPA boundry.
Mr. Kaufman said he did not think this was the appropriate time
or place for this requirement and ask the Commission to accept
Condition 113 as written.
Paul Taddune, City Attorney, said in addition to requiring something
of the applicant a sub paragraph directed toward the City staff,
with regard to the aquisition of the county road, may be appropri-
ate. Richman said he would rather see that as a separate section,
rather than a condition. Mr. Taddune said when it came time
for City Council to enter into an agreement they will require that
the precise plan identify any of the land use considerations and
the agreement would limit the applicant to a development they
were approving in the process. Whether or not the road was part
of that Mr. Taddune was unsure. Mr. Kaufman commented that the road
did not fall in to any of the areas being designated SPA, therefore,
he did not see why it would be appropriate to include platting
of an area not part of the SPA review. Richman said the issue
came about as an 8040 Greenline review.
White said his concern was that the mountain was going to be
changed, which will include the road, and he wants to be sure
that the road remains the same kind of road that exists. Mr. Kane
said platting has to do with ownership and fairly delineating
survey boundrys between property owners. This is an extensive
and expensive process. It is provided for in the city code where
subdivision of land or change of ownership is part of an applic-
ation. That is not happening here, there is no change of ownership,
therefore, the code does not require subdivision platting. In
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the technical site plan every issue raised by Mr. Blomquist is
being addressed, it is just not being called a platt.
White withdrew his second. Blomquist's motion dies for lack of a
second.
Anderson suggested accepting condition 113, changing the word
"request", in the second sentence, to "expense" and adding
"consistant with Ray Cassin Assoc. report" to the end of the
condi tion.
C"Orrditimr-t-i4: Mr. Kaufman commented that there was an understa-
nding with the Planning Office that the actual deed restriction
would not take place until the hotel goes on line.
Conditron-~:t5~ There were no comments or questions.
Conditi-on--t-i6-~ There were no comments or questions.
Conditiun-tI~ Anderson said it was his recolection that all of
the electrical powerlines to the east side of Galena St. would be
underground as part of this application. Mr. Kane said he
thought there had been a misunderstanding about who would be
responsible for this. The undergrounding from the pole in the
middle of Dean St. to the Continental was to be accomplished when
the Continental chose to install underground electric for their
building. The assumption now is that they will not want to do
that until their building has been rebuilt because of the big
expense. Mr. Kane said their understanding was that it would
remain overhead until the Continental made a decision, or the
Aspen Mountain Lodge project was resolved. Anderson said the Ski
Co. had committed to work from the east side of Galena toward
the project. Mr. Kane said Holy Cross Electric had done extensive
undergrounding in the area and had differed this line because of
the Aspen Mountain Lodge project. It will be undergrounded
through the street improvement district or made a condi tion of
the application. Mr. Kane said it was their understanding it
would be undergrounded through the street improvement district.
Hunt said it was his understanding this would be undergrounded by
the time this project was complete. Mr. Kaufman said the misund-
erstanding took place in that it was agreed that it would be
undergrounded but the other portions would have to be tied in.
This appl icant can not be responsible for a proj ect that may
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never get built. Mr. Forsch said their commitment was to underg-
round everything on their site at such time as the Aspen Mountain
Lodge was buil t. Hunt said the utilities east of the pole on
Galena St. should be underground by the end of this project.
Motiom
White moved that all electrical wires on the project site to the
pole east of Galena St. will be placed underground by the applicant;
Peyton seconded.
Dtscussi~m Colombo suggested amending the motion to say "by the
time the proj ect comes on line". Mr. For sch suggested doing it
under the same terms and conditions as the paving, Condition 15.
Richman suggested combining the language with Condition 15.
Peyton commented that Condition 15 was complicated, as it exists.
White thought Condition 117 should be kept separate. White added
the major electrical work would be done when the gondola and
hotel were put in and the utility undergrounding could be done at
the same time.
All in favor; motion carried.
eond itiorrs----tTa-;-t-]:9-.-t-21r;-t-2j;-;~_2_h
questions.
There were no comments or
Cvmlltiurr-t-23-: Richman said the applicant had requested additional
language stating "in the event the growth allocations for the
project in the "C" zone shall expire the boundry shall revert to
its prior configuration". Richman thought that was an important
clarification.
Anderson asked for public comment. Hans Gramiger said there may
be a zoning map mistake, thinking the CC SPA zone was only
intended to cover the north side of the lot, therefore there is a
possibility that there is only 22,000 sq.ft. of CC zoning. Even
the site that has been depicted is short 2,424 sq.ft. because the
applicants calculation does not correspond to the designation of
the zoning map. Mr. Gramiger said he did not think the Commission
had fulfilled the charge they were responsible for in the areas
of open space, FAR, parking, grading for ski lifts when it should
be for a hotel, the drop-off area, ski lift operation plan,
employee housing, no views of public strets, no SPA boundry
change is warranted into the "C" zone, the GMP quota, conditional
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use for the hotel, and it should be conditioned in approval that
the parcel can never be severed into one or more other parcels.
Mr. Gramiger proposed that this Commission had recommended, in
1975, public aqusition of critical properties in which the Aspen
Ski Company property was listed. Again, in 1985, the Commission
expressed concern that the SPA designation should have language
that not only the developer has the perogative to ask for variations
from the underlying zone but that also the City should have the
same right. Mr. Gramiger said the Commission had completely
neglected the citizen of Aspen in green space and parking.
Anderson entered a letter from Spencer Shiffer in to the record
stating they do not believe Condition 120, regarding the boundry
adjacent to the Tippler, had been resolved. Mr. Kaufman said the
applicant had committed that this particular application does not
intend to include the Tippler deck. Hunt commented that if that
piece of property came in to the applicant's posession he thought
it should be incl uded, by amendment to the SPA. Hunt wanted
language in the conditions reflecting this. Richman suggested
language.
White said he would like to see a new condition to the effect
that the property would not be split up. Anderson commented that
the property could not be split up without going through a
subdivision process, under any ownership. Blomquist said the
technical way to achieve White's concern was to have the property
platted as a lot, with deed restrictions through the platt.
Richman said he did not see what would be accomplished by prohib-
iting the subdivision, when subdivision is something this Commission
would have to review. Anderson said this application was an SPA
Precise Plan and platting was not part of this procedure.
MuLlun:
COlombo moved to approve Resolution 186-3, subject to amendments
made at this meeting on March 18, 1986, authorizing the Chairman
to sign off on the amendments; Tygre seconded.
DI-sCtrS5Tum
Peyton said she would like to have the minority opinion also
included in the motion. It was the opinion that should be a
separate motion. Hunt said he would vote against this approval
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for the primary reason of the skier parking. Hunt said he was,
however, in favor of the hotel project and the gondola.
Whi te commented that he supported the hotel proj ect. However,
he had some major questions. White said he had for a long time
believed in the concept of a trade off in the SPA. Parking is
totally inadequate, believing there should be at least 36 more
spaces, disappointment in the transit studies and their conclusions
not taking into acount the Aspen Mountain Master Plan or the
gondola, the "grand" entrance to the City was not addressed, and
circulation has not been properly addressed. White said he did
not think the Commission had done their job.
Anderson asked
Blomquist
Colombo
Tygre
Hunt
Peyton
White
Anderson
Hunt and Peyton
for a roll
aye
aye
aye
no
no
aye
aye
opposed;
call vote:
all others in favor; motion carried.
Paul Taddune, City Attorney, said there were two ways to handle
the minority opinion. Any person who voted in the minority has
the right to submit a report to City Council stating why they
think the proposal should be rejected. However, that can be
submitted independently or it can be agreed as a Commission that
if members do want to submit a minority report that it be apended
to the majority report so that City Council can consider the
majority comments at the same time it considers the minority.
Mr. Taddune thought the later was the best practice.
Motiom
Hunt moved to apend the minority report to Resolution '86-3;
Tygre seconded. All in favor; motion carried.
E-ImLIC IIUlRIlIG
ou..dY PAItIt PROJBCf RBSIDIlftIAL GNP SCORIJIG SBSSIOlI
Doug Allen, attorney for the 601 Aspen St. project, said they
understood that all applications were continued from January 28,
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"WCH 18. 1986
1986 to March 18, 1986. He had a letter reinstating their
application subject to certain conditions and they presently have
an appeal pending before the Board of Adjustment. Paul Taddune,
City Attorney, asked what the position of the applicant was with
regard to the appeal before the Board of Adjustment. Mr. Allen
replied they would not have an answer until the next day, giving
them enough time to study the letter just received from the
Planning Office.
Tygre opened the public hearing on the Sunny Park project.
Gideon Kaufman, applicant's attorney, said the Planning Office's
suggested scoring was just under the minimum threshold. By
scoring the project just under the threshold the whole viability
of the project will be killed, if the Commission agrees.
Mr. Kaufman thought the Planning Office did not carefully examine
the scoring criteria and recommendations from Jay Hammond, City
Engineer. Mr. Kaufman said if they had not ignored the recommen-
dations and criteria the project would have clearly met the
threshold. Mr. Kaufman said there needed to be a degree in
continuity in scoring, in determining the type of projects the
communi ty would like to see built. Whether a project meets the
threshold should not be determined by who the planners are that
score the project, or what composite the Planning Office is at
the time. A projects desirability needs to meet the test of
time, not the subjective determination of the planning staff.
This project has been before the Planning Office and this Commission
before. The last time it was reviewed by the Planning Office it
found it exceeded the minimum threshold by 10 points, now under a
similar but different scoring criteria a project that has been
improved is found to not meet the threshold.
Mr. Kaufman said when the Planning Office scored the project the
first time it was given 2 points under community/commercial
facilities, because the staff at that time felt the project was
located within 6 blocks walking distance of the commercial
facility in town. The new planning score shows a different
finding, now 8 blocks walking distance. The project has not
changed and the commercial facilities in town have not changed.
Mr. Kaufman said that Mr. Gibson, applicant, would show later how
the project was scored properly the first time and improperly this
time. Mr. Kaufman said that one issue would bring the project
over the threshold.
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MARCIl 18. 1!J86
Mr. Kaufman said another area that could not be disputed was the
points that the applicant should be given for its commitment to
curbs and sidewalks. The Planning Office has chosen to disregard
the recommendation of Jay Hammond that the commitments made by
the applicant exceed joining the improvement district. If the
City decides to seek the formation of an improvement district it
talks to people and decides if the distict should be formed, then
trys to set up a formula for assessment. Neighbors and citizens
have an opportunity to oppose the district and very often they
are defeated even when the City wants one formed. Once an
improvement district has been formed the City makes the improvements
and the amount of money that is paid by the individual property
owner varies. This is a long and arduous task before the improv-
ements are made. Depending on the formula used the percent that
a property pays for the curbs and gutters can be as little as 10%
or as much as 100%. Mr. Kaufman asked the Commission to compare
that to their commitment. They have come forward and offered to
build the curbs and sidewalks at their own expense, without the
need for an improvement district. Additionally, they have been
told by the Engineering Department that while they would like to
see this applicant do this the Engineering Dept. is not certain
what the best alignment would be for the curbs, gutters, and
sidewalks thereby asking the applicant to wait until a plan was
devised. The applicant agreed and made their application based
on the Engineering Department's recommendation. Mr. Kaufman
concluded saying to score the applicant the same as if all they were
commi ting to do was join an improvement district was not only
unfair but clearly wrong.
Mr. Kaufman said they were told by the Planning Off ice that one
of the reasons they did not meet the threshold was because they
should have gone out in to the neighborhood looking for things to
improve. The Planning Office could not identify any things that
should have been improved. Mr. Kaufman thought it was important
to look at the kind of project being proposed. It is 4 studio
units and 4 employee units which are intended for low income,
local type housing. The applicant is not trying to create a
project that costs a whole lot of money, nor looking to spend
money on improvements that the neighborhood may not even need.
The applicant did, however, find some constructive things to do.
As noted in the memorandum from RFTA, the bus shel ter this applicant
is offering to build not only will benefit the residents of this
project but others who live close by. Yet no where in the
Planning Office's suggested scoring is the extra expenditure
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RBC6ItD OF PItOCI!lIlDllIGS
IlBGUIiAlt- MBIlYIIIG-- PLARRIlIG Alft) JOIIIIIG OODISSIOR
MARCIl 18-;--ff86
of money for the shelter used to give the applicant extra points
for improving the neighborhood.
Mr. Kaufman said this project had previously been scored in 1982,
several of the current Commissioners were also Commissioners at
that time. In those days the threshold was 43, at that time the
lowest score was given by Hunt which was 51 1/2. The Planning
Office scored it 53. All of the scores greatly exceeded the
threshold. In the first scoring session the Planning Office scored
neighborhood compatibility a 3 and all of the Commissioners gave
a score of 3, now the category is being given a score of 2 and
this proposal is better. In the area of site design, again the
old Planning Office gave a score of 3 along with every Commissioner
and now it is being given a 2. In the areas of energy and open
space the same applies.
Mr. Kaufman said at the time the project first came in there was
a problem with the roads, since that period of time the roads
have been upgraded because of the Centennial project. None the less
the applicant has committed to 2 things that will improve the
roads in the area, the bus shelter and curbs gutters and sidewalks.
Mr. Kaufman thought those improvements were deserving of a score
of 2 rather than the suggested I point.
Mr. Kaufman said he thought the project deserved to meet the
threshold and deserved to be built. When examined in light of
the other projects in the neighborhood this is a superior project
in the neighborhood and a needed and desirable proj ect for the
community.
Dave Gibson, applicant's architect, explained and outlined on a
map the walking distance to the commercial core. Mr. Gibson said
the PI anning Off ice had measured the di stance by way of the
Hopkins St. bridge, in which case the distance from this project
is slightly more than 6 blocks. However, most pedestrians would
not use that route. The shortest distance between the two points
would probably be down King St., across the Mill St. bridge, and
on past Herron Park, being less than 6 blocks from the commercial
core. Mr. Gibson said based on this proposed walking route he
would ask the Commission to award a score of 2 points.
Mr. Gibson said they are required by code to look at the quality
of design based on 4 possible categories. Mr. Gibson said there
was more than one way to look at the concept of excellence and
IS
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RECORD OF nocr;BDIRGS
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MRCR 18. ItS6
the concept of acceptable standard. The first way that comes to
mind would be to look at the intrinsic qualities that something
has, if the drawings and project seem to work together grade on
that basis. Another way to judge excellence would be to take in
context excellence with reference to what, standard with reference
to what. Mr. Gibson said this neighborhood is in an area of town
where real estate sells for approximately $120. per square foot.
In near by areas real estate sells for as much as $300. per
square foot. Mr. Gibson said he would like to suggest that it
was not appropriate to use the standard of excellence used on one
of the near by areas to grade this project. He proposed that
this project be looked at in reference to its surroundings, what
would be excellent in this location.
Mr. Gibson said, regarding neighborhood compatibility, the
parking was standard and acceptable for the area. The exposed
dumpsters are also standard and acceptable in the area. Also
standard in the area are large block buildings. Mr. Gibson said
while they are trying to be compatible with the neighborhood they
are also trying to improve on the compatibility.
Regarding site design, Mr. Gibson said the previous project on
this site was right at the set back. It was a 3 story building.
This proposal has I 1/2 story elements along the street, a fence,
and a set back of 20 to 30 feet. Mr. Gibson said he would
suggest that their site design was not standard but rather an
excellent site design.
Mr. Gibson said he also felt they had an excellent energy design.
Regarding the trails Mr. Gibson said they had done as much as was
possible for the location. Mr. Gibson felt they should be scored
at least standard on the trails.
Mr. Gibson said the previous application had 37% open space.
Mr. Gibson said just because space is undeveloped does not mean
it is open space, unless it is open to the street it does not
count. With the new application it has been opened up to the
street. Additionally, they have committed to hydroseed and
irrigate all of the city property, inCluding 6 Aspen and 2 Blue
Spr uce trees. Mr. Gibson said he fel t the green space was not
only above code with 32% of the lot but another 4,000 feet of
City property that would be planted and maintained, suggesting an
excellent score.
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Steve Burstein, planner, distributed score sheets to the Commiss-
ioners. Burstein said the changes in this application, from the
previous application, were undergrounding utilities, more employee
housing, and the under grounding involved with parking. That
explains the difference in the scoring of the 2 applications.
Burstein said the Planning Office considered the project to be a
good, but standard project.
Anderson opened the public hearing.
Tim Fortier, neighbor, thought the proposed project would be a
good amenity for the neighborhood. He commented there were no
other projects in the area that looked as good. The bus shelter
would also be a nice amenity for the community. Mr. Fortier
thought this project would clean up the neighborhood.
Anderson closed the public hearing.
Whi te commented that he I ived behind the proposed proj ect and
this proposal is 150% better than any other project in the area.
Whi te suggested that the bus shelter should be turned to face
Park Circle. White said the curb and gutter would al so be an
amenity.
Hunt said it appeared the building in the south east corner went
right to the property line. Mr. Gibson said there was a 6 foot
fence on the property line. Additionally, balconies are allowed
by code to project up to 1/3 into the set back.
The Commissioners scored the project. Ms. Tygre left the meeting
at 7:20 P.M.
Btlr...u PAItX PRMBc.r COJICI!:a!'IuAL REYIBlf/SPBf:TM. IUWIBIf
lIoti-orrl
Colombo moved to exempt the employee housing in the Sunny Park
division from the Growth Management Plan process; Hunt seconded.
All in favor; motion carried.
Anderson questioned whether this case should be a full subdivision
exemption or subdivision exception. Burstein said the Planning
Office had agreed it should be a subdivision exemption process,
recommending approval subject to 7 conditions (outlined in the
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REGULAlt DBrIlIG
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MIlCII 18. 1986
Planning Office memorandum dated March 12, 1986). Burstein
reviewed the 7 suggested conditions.
Mr. Kaufman said they had a problem with condition 16. The water
course described is not on the applicant's property. The Enviro-
nmental Health Department has indicated by memorandum that there
has not been a problem but that it may become a problem.
Mr. Kaufman did not think that a fence would be necessary for a
problem that may come up. The City owns a park across the street
and they have not fenced it. White commented that a fence
would block off a pleasant view. Peyton suggested striking
condition 16 from the approval.
MollulIl
Hunt moved to recommend that City Council grant the requested
subdivision exception for the purpose of constructing a multiple
family dwelling subject to conditions II through 13, and conditions
#5 and 17, outlined in the Planning Office memorandum dated March
12, 1986; Peyton seconded. All in favor; motion carried.
su........ - pAliIl[ PliIl'lo"lBC'l' I'UD REVIEW
1Ioti0Dl
Blomquist moved to determine that the Sunny Park development is
exempt from the requirements of PUD; Peyton seconded. All in
favor; motion carried.
su........ PIdtK PROOZC'l' -I'A1tltIJIG EDIIPfIOll SPECIAL REVIEIf
Mullun:
Hunt moved to deny the request for a reduction in parking spaces,
resulting in eleven on-site parking spaces; Peyton seconded. All
in favor; motion carried.
Anderson adjourned the meeting at 7:40 P.M.
~~-uJ~~Is-- ---
Kim Wilhoit, Deputy City Clerk
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