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HomeMy WebLinkAboutminutes.apz.19820622 RECORD OF PROCEEDINGS 100 Leaves FO~M '" C. F. HOECKEL a. B. 1:1: L. co. PLANNING AND ZONI"c; COMlllSSION REGULAR HEETING Jmm 22, 1982 The Planning and oning Commission had a regular meeting on June 24, 1982 at 5:00PM in the City Council Chambers of City Hall. Perry Harvey called the meeting to order with members welton Anderson, Jasmine Tygre, Al Blomquist, Roger Hunt, Lee Pardee and Pat Fallin present. I. COl~1ISSIONER'S COl1MENTS Perry Harvey said that the l1ayor will be introducing the ?&Z's Commission with background information. Harvey requested that get some Municipal Codes for the P&Z Comraission members. Pat Fallinasked that they receive the City Council Agenda in their boxes. Alan Richman asked the Commission members if they could meet for a work session next Tuesday, June 29, 1982 to discuss a major code amendment which is the conditional and permitted use tables. Sunny Vann said they have one item that is being tabled tonight, which is the ~[ountain Edge Subdivision. The Planning Office will replace the item with the RFospector Lodge issue. Lee Pardee commented that the reason he was late to the meeting was because of the three traffic lights that are not synchronized properly. Welton Anderson asked if anyone noticed that there is no turn on red either. Perry Harvey said that this matter is something that must go to Council. Al Blomquist asked if the P&Z could adopt a traffic plan as a part of the Aspen Area General Plan. Sunny Vann said that the Planning Office will pass on Perry Harvey said that the Commission aasan item that Election of officers Roger Hunt moves to confirm the Election of last Tuesday. Al Blomquist seconds. Gary Esaryasked that the Commission take the vote again. Roger Hunt moves to nominate Perry Harvey as Chairman and Welton Anderson as Vice- Chairman. Lee Pardee seconds. Al Blomquist moves that nominations be closed. Roger ilunt seconds. All in favor. Motion carried. next member to the the Planning Office the CODlmission's concerns. is not on the Agenda, which is, II. I1INUTES Lee Pardee moves to approve the minutes with a few typographical changes. Welton Anderson would like it to be noted that he stepped down on Section 3 of the Public Hearings. Anderson said that on page three the secretary typed " since Welton Anderson does not understand the logic behind taking 24,OOOsq. ft. a year allocation for CC and Cl." 'welton said that it should read, "Anderson does not understand the logic behind reducing the 24,000 sq. ft. a year for CC and Cl to I5,000a year for CC and Cl. Lee Pardee noves to have the minutes of Welton Anderson and as amended with him Jasmine Tygre seconds. All in favor. Motion carried. Pat Fallin commented that her name is mispel1ed in the Roger Hunt moves to table action on the minutes of ~1ay Lee Pardee seconds. Motion carried. All in favor. June 8, 1982 approved as verbally to the Deputy City Clerk. amended by }ffiy 4, 1982 minutes. 4, 1982 to the next P&Z meeting. III. PUBLIC HEARING A. Arthur's Restaurant, Inc. - Expansion of a Conditional Use Welton Anderson steps down on this item Colette Penne of the Planning Office said that the request is for an expansion of a Conditional Use of Arthurs's Restaurant into a patio area. Penne said that there have been some questions raised by the neighbors. The dock area, "hich is still being used on the West side of the building, is fairly offensive to the neighborhood and was specifically required as a condition of conditional use to be put at the back of the building. Penne asked Daiv Moss if she was correct in that statement. ,;"...~"""--.,------ - 2 - David Moss said that he still trucks are still dropping off utilized as much. Spence Schiffer said that there has always been outdoor dining at Arthur's. Schiffer said that when HPC approved this they requested and required as a condition to the approval that it be moved from one portion of the dining be moved to another area. Schiffer shows photographs Q~ what it 10Qks like now and commented that it has not been expanded at all. Al Blomquist said that he understands it the patio was in the basic plans, it may not have been mentioned in the minutes however by the recolection of the board it was part of the consideration. Blomquist said that the P&Z's findings should be that it was in the plans as approved that there is no need for a hearing. Lee Pardee said that the P&Z members are not qualified and don't have time to go through a set of plans like this. Pardee said something not brought up as substantial as out-door dining even though it is on the plans, it should be considered. Perry Harvey opens the Public Hearing. George Vicenzi owns property in the vicinity and he would like to get clarification on the loading dock which is on the sideof Arthur's. He feels that the whole problem could be solved if the loading dock were to be moved to the back. Vicenzi feels there is a parking problem. Vicenzi feels that the patio is an asset for Aspen, he wishes the approval would be conditional upon David Moss 1) totally eliminating the dock on the ~st side of the building 2) trying to find places for people to park. Perry Harvey closes the public portion of the meeting. Harvey said that it would appear that there are a couple of problems. That the fence is being constructed in order to get this and not when it was supposed to have been It appears that all of the parking that was in there is not being maintained or being fully used and that thelQBding dock has been provided on the back of the building and that the one on the West side of the building should be eliminated, moved or changed so that there would not be a double loading system there. Roger Hunt said that because this is a conditional use and the P&Z should look at the whole property, assuming it is an expansion of a conditional use and any thing that is inappropriate or appropriate, the P&Z should look at, at the time and correct. Al Blomquist said that the P&Z could require that the kitchen door to the West be permanently closed so that the only access could be from the back door. Perry Harvey does not agree that the door has to be bricked up, but a sign could be placed indicating that the loading dock is in the rear. Roge, Hunt said that the restaurant should use the alley loading dock for deliveries shall sign the West door, both deliveries use the rear dock, if necessary, shall appropriately landscape area of the West dock to prevent truck access and allow parking. Jasmine Tygre said that the P&Z should not necessarily say how to keep people from using that West loading dock as a loading dock, Tygre thinks the P&Z should leave that up to the applicant Spence Schiffer feels that an area is being brought up that he doesn't think is appro- priate for discussion now. Perry Harvey said that he does not think this inappropriate because if that loading dock was supposed to have been moved to the rear of the building, and there is still unloading going on, on the West side of the building, it is then a condition that has not been met. Roger Hunt moves to approve the expansion of the operation of Arthur's Restaurant as a conditional use in the "0" office zone, for the plrposes of outside dining in the patio to the East of the Restaurant for June 15, ---- thru Sept. 15, each year with the following conditions: 1. That the Environmental Health Department approve the arrangement. 2. That the construction of the fence to screen the alley parking area be completed. 3. That a sign indicating,"guest parking in the rear," be added to 0, in the vicinity of the restaurants front sign, as appears appropriate to advise guests utilizing automobiles. 4. The restaurant shall advise suppliers to use the alley loading dock for deliveries, shall sign the West dock "deliveries use rear dock.", if necessary. Shall appropriately landscape area of the West dock to prevent truck access and to allow parking. Spence Schiffer brought up two points; Hunt stated it is the East on the front. Roger Hunt amends the first portion of the motion to say the patio to the front and the east of therestaurant. David Moss would like to voice a slight disagreement the whole thing is perfect except that the situation is not helped by requiring landscaping. Roger Hunt amends his fourth condition of the motion, as an alternative to landscaping arailing around the existing dock making it a porch would be an alternate or appropriate manner. Hunt rephrases ; a railing to prevent the use of the area as a dock would be an appropriate alternative to landscaping. Lee Pardee seconds. All in favor. Motion carried. would not consider th~t ~ dock, Moss said th~t the orders from the Main St. and that the rear area is not in the motion "to the east" "~ ./ , I RECORD OF PROCEEDINGS 100 Leaves FORM" C. F. ~OECKEL B. B. !Ie L. CD. PLANNING AND ZONING CO~IISSION REGULAR NEETING JUNE 22, 1982 3 - Roger Hunt moves to table Mountain Edge Subdivision at the request of the applicant. Jasmine Tygre seconds. All in favor. Motion carried. Prospecter Lodte - Sunny Vann of the Planning office said that a letter is being dis- tributed which summarizes the changes from the plans that were approved vs. the plans that are currently at the building department for request of changes. Vann said that the changes that relate to the exterior of the building such as the outdoort jacuzzi, hot tub, etc. have already been approved as appropriate modifications by the HPC. Vann said there is no motion needed for this issue but that the applicant wanted to bring this before the P&Z. Vann said that the Planning Office made an administrative decision that there was not sufficient change to the effect of their review and a letter from the City Attorney that any of these changes would be authorized by the Building Dept. but that they would be building at their own risk and if necessary the Planning office could bring it back to P&Z. RESOLUTIONS A. Commending Olof Hedstrom for Service on Planning and Zoning Commission. Welton Anderson would like to add a few Whereas'a to the Planning Office Resolution. Whereas, Olof Hedstrom's tenure as chairman typified an unusual sensitivity to the voice concerns of each citizen as well as the community as a whole and exemptlarly willingness to listen to those concerns and ~11ereas, Olof always exhibited a gracious style of leadership that should be a lesson to all elected and appointed office. Al Blomquist accepts the proposals and feels that the Resolution should be single- spaced and on one page, on parchment and framed and have a party. Welton Andersoc said that he be happy to do the Resolution in calligraphy form. Al Blomquist moves the approval of the Resolution as discussed. Welton Anderson seconds. All in favor. Motion carried. VI. PL~~NING ISSUES A. Discussion of Nonconforming Lodge Alternatives (time permitting) Alan Richma*~ of the Planning Office , said that the purpose of this is for an infamal type of .work session attempt at getting at the issues and getting at the alternatives before we get to a Public Hearing stage on any potential Code changes. The Planning office is trying as much as they can , as a general rule, when they are dealing with major legislation, to meet with the P&Z once at least before any public hearing. Richman said that Council has taken this on as a major issue on their legislative agenda. Richman said that this is a major land-use Planning issue for the community. Richman said that the key issue is what happened in the 1973 Land-use plan in the dOWllzoning., but in order to understand the '73 Land-use plan we have to go back to 1966 plan., which established where the appropriate land-uses would be in Aspen. Richman finds the projections of the 1966 Plan remarkably close to what they are turning out to be 16 or 17 years later. The totals are turning out to be amazingly accurate. Richman said that if the P&Z looks at the Land-use Plan for Aspen the 1973 Plan, the most prominent Lodge related reconunendation is the physical contraction of the accomodation and recreation as substantially reduced from what was shown on the 1966 Plan, to something that really approximates the area at the base of Aspen Mountain. Richman said that if you look at the areas which formerly had been indicated as accom- odations and recreation within the City they are now indicated as Mixed residential. The intent and purpose of the mixed residential category is rather interesting. Richman said it is to allow for a mix of residential uses interspersed with limited amounts of professional office and visitor accomodation uses in areas where these conditions presently exist. Richman said that only existing lodges should be considered for ex- pansion. Richman said there is a very significant policy statement on the Land-use Plan which does not show up in the subsequent zoning. Richman said that the Planning Office took a dOWllzoning action both in the City and in the County which was certainly sweeping in its nature. It was designed clearly to slow the rate of growth and to get at what the Planning Office was experiencing in the 60's and 70's. Richman said this was done in a way that in every case it was not necessarily coincident with the Land-use Planning. That is quite an acceptable condition in the State of Colorado, although it may not be considered to be the most desirable to have inconsistencies between our Land-use Plan and oUr Zoning Plan. ._- - 4 - Richman said that it would be much more desireable to have that consistency. Richman said that at the present time the Planning Office is really in quite a different situation; Growth control in the Planning Office's mind is still a very significant and major issue and they continue to be working within the GMP to be controlling growth but there are additional problems which many secotrs of the community are identifying as importnat as growth control. one of those problems is the issue of quality, value and lodging and many people have been indicating to the Planning Office that we need to be taking an action to be providing incentives for that quality and value of lodging in addition to providing for growth control environmetal quality etc. The Planning Office thinks that there is reason to believe that the zoning action taken back in the mid 70's were at least one factor that has contributed to the quality and value problem. Richman does not think it is appropriate to say the zoning ~ctions are the only reason that ther may have been some quality and value fall-off in the community. Richman said that he thinks it is clear that the non-conforming status of many of Aspen Lodges is clearly one of the reasons contributing to the quality and value problem. Al Blomquist said that his concern is with the avoidance of a definitional and all short term., including all short term in the definition, and that is a functional area in where they are located and so on and it raises that whole problem of the single family housing in the West end, which is then stolen from the employee housing availability. Richman said that is an issue that the Planning Office wants to deal with and is one the Planning office in their response to the Task force of the Lodging association indicated that they would begin to tackle in the Planning office redraft of the short term accomodation report. Al Blomquist said that he can't see how the Planning office can zone to use for just lodges or how the planning office can evaluate before alternative methods., Sunny Vann said that you can leave the definition exactly the way it is; when you start talking about changing the definition then you also have the change the way you deal with zoning use. Alan Richman said the Planning office's alternatives are based on questions of zoning. The Planning office has come up with a "do nothing alternative", an alternative which would extend the existing lodge preservation provisions, and alternative which would create an overlay zone district of lodge preservation and an alternative which we call rezoning to use which may not be the most appropriate term but some type of zoning action which would make or create a zone. Richman dicusses the approach number 4; Zoning the lodges to Use. Richman said that there are a couple of ways that this could be done. There are two lodge zones L-l and L-2 which could be used in those areas where you may not have non-conforming lodges or alternativly the Planning office could come up with a third zone andL&3 zone which would certainly take care of the problem. Richman feels that the Planning office favors the L-3 approach because there are justm- fiable reasons for coming up with a new zone district; 1) the Planning office would not have to take the intent of the existing L-l and L-2 zone districts and play with that intent, one issue would be the intent could be formulated very specifically in that direction. 2) the area and bulk question could be dealt with very specifically and the planning office could formulate an area and bulk which is very compatable with the West End and the East End as opposed to area and bulk questions which are appropriate for the downtown base of Aspen MountainL-l and L-2 areas. Perry Harvey asked the Planning office if they really think they could formulate an area and bulk that would allow any more than 0ge or two of these lodges to have any room for expansion. Alan Richman responded by saying that based on the Planning offices analysis of the existing build-out of those lodges -- yes. Richman said there is a need for some of the lodges to expand and would help to meet the need for a moderate level of lodge expansion. Richman said that the short term accomoda- tions report doesn't lead the Planning office to be looking for more and more units. He feels that the hope is that lodge owners would be able to use the existing number of units that they have. Lee Pardee said that he would like to address a problem he has with this. The community as a whole has voted again and again in choosing its elected officials on the basis of their adhering to the GMP. Pardee said that there is !n overwhelming consensus of what the community needs. It ssem to Pardee that by having a separate category rather than just giving bonus points for reconstruction, to take awy from overall lodge rooms available for the next forseeable future and to say that we are not going to give to the best project of the community. L-i, L-2, L-3 and probably next year L-4 -- Pardee's concern is that the communitys best interest are being converted; a Broadmoor type place will never get built. Pardee is very much in favor of expansion, rehabilitation and lodge preservation but not when it flys ;in the face of community inter- est. -....",., " , ,...., RECORD OF PROCEEDINGS 100 Leaves fORM 'G C. F. HOI::'~El a. B. 8- l. (;J. PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION REGULAR MEETING JUNE 22, 1982 - 5 - Sunny Vann said that first of all the Planning office only threw this out as a suggestion as they suspected that asi~ grew the P&Z might be concerned about the ability of a smaller lodge to compete under the new quota. Vann said that the other aspect of this is; by doing it as a separate quota for these type of units, then the Planning office could devise some changes in their competition procedure, that makes it a simpler process for a smaller model. Roger Hunt said that in all of their discussions the P&Z accepted the zoning but didn't like it because P&Z realized it made every lodge a non-conforming use except in the L-l L-2 Snnny Vann said that there is still a question that has to be addressed from a legal point of view but the planning office feels very strongly that they are on solid ground. The Planning office has a session with the non-conforming lodge owners in which one of the Council members was present and there is a difference of opinion in the recollection as to what the intent was in terms of the non-conforming. Vann said that this would maintain the mix and safeguards against problems of being zoning vacant 0] rezoning other lands or new lodge development through the very specific intent of the zone district being created. Al Blomquist would like the staff to prepare alternatives 3 and 4 so that the P&Z can compare the two approaches to solution. Blomquist would like thwm to show in both cases how they handeled the definition of problem. Blomquist feels that they should finally the whole short term issue. Perrv Harvev asked Al what his concern is here; Harvey said that there are two ways to look at this definition problem. 10 to restate the definition to eliminate houses and duplexes and other units which are short term, from that market. 2) to allow lodges, basicly would incorporate kitchen in their facilities. Blomquist said that the problem is that the condo's and the apartments and the single family houses vs. the hotel room type lodge are all inter-mixed in that mixed residential area. Theyare all in the same business and there are shifts taking place all the time where the owner says its out of the market and then it is back in. Blomquist is saying that the zoning should deal with short terming as short terming not as hotel room vs. apartment vs. single. Sunny Van~ said that what Al is talking about doing is the ability to collect revenues off anybody that short terms. Vann said that the other aspect of it is; the Planning office currently preclude in the RMF zone district the ability to short term new multifamily construction. Perry Harvey asked if there is anyone that would like to give further insight. Mark Danielson said that he would like to say that he agrees with the planning office recommendation. He feels that the best way to go is to create a different type of zone an L-3 zone and should have a separte GMP, primarily from the standpoint of the fact that most current non-conforming lodges would have different criteria for evaluation. Danielson said that the only question he has concerns the Planning office memo which stated that the non-conforming lodges would basicly go through a review process to become conforming. Sunny Vann said that rather than the City and the Planning office coming to the P&Z and asked them to initiate rezoning all these problems, the Planning office is suggesting an easier way of doing it on a case by case basis. Al Blomouist asked if they could get a legal opinion that identifies the Planning office quotation that is justifying this spot zoning and then a showing of how much case load or whatever there is saying that you can't do it. Roger Hunt has'.a quick question on L-3; procedurally someone that is zoned L-3 and then wants to come in for an expansion he in effect goes through conditional expansion and conditional use procedure or what? Sunnv Vann said that they may have a problem adopting a uniform FAR for an L-3 zone district because they might be apppicable in one situation may not be applicable in another. Tony Percival. Lodge owner, said that his feeling is let's not getted bogged down in this thing; we are talking about extension FAR all sorts od things. The simplicity of it is right there - change the use non-conforming to conforming Sunny Vann said that he would concur generally, however the Planning office cannot over- look and responsible react for a potential for problems, plus there is a responsibility to the neighbors as well. __.....~II___-. ... - 6 - Sunny Vann suggests, that given Percival's concerns, there aren't that many real problems in this approach and there is a legal problem Vann feels comfortable that the Planning office can resolve and other problem is what bulk are they allowed to expand in. Vann thinks that what is needed ther is to go out and look at what the expansion capabilities are and the Planning office has dealt with these neighborhoods as far as the FAR for the residential sections and they can come back with a reasonible approach to get the job done. Lee Pardee said that there is a third point is that the whole GMP suffered allocations Sunny Vann said that he is not adiment one way or the other and that it depends the P&Z's ability first of all to determine the projects and the other is major consid- ation is whether or not the lodge competition proces as currently revised provides adequate mechanisms or the small lodge who is previously non-conforming and now conforminl the ability to compete succesfully. We can look at that and find that there is nothing there that is going to prohibit him from competing against the larger applicant and secondly that there is your comfort with your ability to award them bonus. It is impera- tive to either provide for a separate quota and or a revised competition procedure that tracts along with the new submission requirements or scoring mechanisms or whatever. Perry Harvey polls the commission on their feelings on Planning going ahead in terms of a new zone, rezoning these non-conforming lodges to use and also what you think about separate GMP or if you think it can be incorporated. Welton Anderson said that comingup with a set of criteria that are needed for a separate GMP competition plus the non-conforming uses,coming up with something that is going to work can take a "Cod awful long time" and if the immediate concer for some lodge owners is to be taken out of the non-conforming status and be able to borrow money and do whatever else is necessary to upgrade the lodge to facilitate that by, to provide a separate zoning district".and then coming up with the criteria for allowing a certain number of things to be done with that zoning designation. Pat Fallin said that she would like to see the non-conforming stigma removed. Fallin doesn't want to go to "over-kill" on this thing, she thinks that if we expand and remodel it is automatically going to make Aspen the "Queen City" again. Fallin said that she is not sure what the solution is but she does not think we need to expand and double size of the boomerang, will heal the economic ills that face us today. Jasmine Tygre said that she thinks that the rezOning to Use Plan and creating and creatinl a specific zoning for these lodges seems to her to be the most logical way to go. Tygre said that assuming that the legal question can be resolved, which Sunny thinks it can be, it would seem to her that this does cover public policy, although subordinated to the idea of the policy that as a resort community it is very important for existing lodges to be able to upgrade to the point where they are more comfortable and more benefit to a tourist community. So it seems to Tygre that as far as direction to the Planning office, she thinks they should go ahead with the ramifications of this but will have to be able to put all the necessary controls on it to make it correct and not just act because there is a pressing need. Tygre said that the P&Z will have to do it right this time. Tygre would prefer to see the Planning Dept. spend its time on the refinement of Plan # 4 rather than spending any kind of work time in going through the alterna- tives. Tygre thinks that Alan Richman's memo and work that the Planning office has done ( one this is very helpful because it does put it into perspective as to what has happened and that this approach is a good one. Tygre's feeling at this paticular point is that we may end up with a separate GMP category but that it is too soon to make that kind of determination. Ro~er Hunt said that soon after he came onto this Board he tried to convince them that th, that the lodges that they were down-zoning to non-conformidy, Hunt felt that the solution should have been defineing or not as a conditional use wherever they are located and at that time they decided they couldn't do that, it didn't m~tter what zone it was in Hunt felt an existing lodge should have had the benefit of being a conditional use in whatever zone it was in. Hunt said that this idea comes as close to doing that if it is legal. So there for Hunt really prefers this approach from a land-use viewpoint. Hunt said that Growth Management is another problem; Hunt can separate Land-use and Growth management, one is "where-do you want it" and the other is "how fast do you want it". What the solution is going to be growth management wise should not interfere with our decision as to what is best from a land-use viewpoint. Hunt said that he can see they will have to go either way; either it can be included in all the lodge districts for competition or we may have to separate it out. He doesn't know this. answer yet but that is an answer they can come up at an appropriate time. Hunt thinks that if this is legal it is the appropriate direction to go with a separate zoning. Lee Pardee thinks it would be nnwise for the P&Z to accept the L-3 without having gone through the complete FAR. Pardee would suggest that they take a look at the graph area again. Pardee feels very strongly about the GMP having a separate category for L-3 if the P&Z finds there are inequities would change again the allocation procedure in~ stead of having a separate, we make it more equal but that we always want to be able to look at all the projects on the board and this is the one that Aspen needs. , / '''' / RECORD OF PROCEEDINGS 100 Leaves FORM ~D C. F. HOECKEl B. B. II LCD. PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION REGULAR MEETING JUNE 22, 1982 - 7 - Al Blomquist said that assuming that we won't protect the definitional problem at this time, he would like to suggest a fifth proposal; in the 0 zone and the RMF zone you add the word existing lodge under a use by right and new lodge as a conditional use. Sunny Vann sa~d that then you open up the basic question that any property can come in and petition to be rezoned for lodge use. Al Blomquist said that there are some sights where it might be appropriate; N, 0 & RMF. Perrv Harvey said there may be some sights where it may be appropriate. ~unny Vann said that rather than debating at this time let the Planning office come back with a response to his request. Perry Harvey said that he thinks that this new zonwe approach is the right way to do it. Harvey personally feels that they are going to need a separate growth management system simply because while we might have a pressing need for a large luxury hotel that certainly is not the only need in the lodging industry in this town and it is also several years away and perhaps some of these enterprising lodge owners can give up some upgraded facilities faster. Harvey said they would not necessarily get the whole quota but what Harvey wants is not to split them up and have an L-3 competition that has X number of units, then they can't get the whole quota. Harvey said lets take a look at the lodge preservation ordinance; in other wotds, there is language in there which may become unneeded about the tenative first step toward conformidy, where we said that they weren't non-conforming but they were conforming. Harvey said that the methodology for this rezoning was that the individual owner would CO! come in and request a rezoning. Harvey asked if this goes once a year? Sunny Vann said that the Planning office would waive it. Vann said there is no shorter way through the process. the only reason Vann said the planning office would not object to doing it as a class action for all the lodges provided however that Council is willing to amend the Planning office work program to provide them the time and a reason to do it. Roger Hunt said that every lodge that it is interested to come under this by such ans such a date would apply, they would get the first group first and then it is on an in- dividual basis thereafter. Alan Richman said lets do this right and in an orderly fashion. Perry Harvey said that on that note of doing it right and orderly, he entertains a motion to adjourn. Roger Hunt so Jasmine Tygre All in favor. moves. seconds. Meeting adjourned. Beall Clerk