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HomeMy WebLinkAboutminutes.apz.20070717 ASPEN PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION MEETING- MINUTES- JULY 17. 2007 John Rowland opened the regular meeting of the City of Aspen Planning & Zoning Commission at 4:35 pm. Commissioners present were: Brian Speck, David Guthrie, LJ Erspamer and John Rowland. Dylan Johns recused himself from the Lift One Hearing. Staff present: Jim True, Special Counsel; Chris Bendon, Joyce Allgaier, Jason Lasser, Community Development; Jackie Lothian, Deputy Clerk. DECLARATION OF CONFLICTS OF INTEREST Dylan Johns was conflicted on Lift One. COMMENTS Joyce Allgaier said that there would be an extra meeting on July 24th to keep up with Lift One. CONTINUED PUBLIC HEARING (7/10/7): LIFT ONE CONCEPTUAL PUD/TIMESHARE John Rowland opened the continued public hearing for Lift One. Bob Daniel reiterated the Lift One area Master Plan Goals of history, accessibility and vitality. Daniel said that the history of this area for skiing, the accessibility of increasing the safety of this area was to become a vibrant aspect of our community and the vitality to create some body heat at the bottom of Lift lA. Daniel said that there were some questions about the placement of the museum adjacent to Dean Street and the pedestrian experience in context of the approved HPC conceptual application for the relocation of Skiers Chalet Lodge aka the Ski Museum and where it was originally proposed on the application. Daniel utilized a power point presentation for the views of the proposals. There were two egresses from the garage. Daniel said the ski access from the current edge of the Skiers Chalet was 18 feet to the conifers; between the upper Lift One terminal and the stance of trees was about 24 feet; between Skiers Chalet Steakhouse at the edge of the windbreak (non- historic addition) on the deck and tress was about 8 feet and the bottom terminal and the stand of Aspen tress was about 18 feet of separation. The redevelopment ski access was 22 feet at the upper lift tower; 16 feet between the lift tower and the stair and elevator tower required as part of the egress for the affordable housing with the 8 feet on the other side of the tower and 24 feet between the bottom terminal and the edge of Ski Museum. Daniel said the proposed improvements were re-configured with the Skiers Chalet Steakhouse as affordable housing and the Skiers Chalet Lodge as the Ski Museum. 1 ASPEN PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION MEETING- MINUTES- JULY 17. 2007 Daniel explained the pedestrian or skier access points using power point. The restaurant was a public space and facility as well as the access to the lobby of the lodge. Daniel stated there was a total path of 182 feet, 124 was walking distance from the drop off point to the snow then 58 feet to the lift. LJ Erspamer asked if the ski run came right down to the roundabout. Daniel replied that it does. Erspamer asked if Shadow Mountain Condos were encroaching on the city property. Daniel replied there were some physical encroachments into the city right-of-way at that point. Daniel noted there were some questions raised regarding the public amenities about the relationship between those facilities that would be utilized by members, guests of the lodge and the general public. Daniel said the difference was in the application because they figured out how to place an upper deck on the restaurant for people to watch the Winter National and ski races. Sunny Vann utilized a map showing the site with the 8040 Greenline; the existing zoning was conservation that accommodates ski lifts and the other zoning was lodge and part of the conservation would be rezoned lodge. Daniel used power point to show what winter looked like on the site. Holly noted the winter scenes were taken on race day of the 2005 Winter National. Erspamer asked where the road below the Mountain Queen was located. Allgaier replied that the pull out page 16 showed the road. Daniel said the road was not a ski company access road but rather a fire safety road. Daniel said the use plan was that a membership lodge provides capital to build the project to achieve the goals of the community and not seek the 25% free market component that was allowed under the incentive lodge program. Daniel said the use plan addresses the issue of accessibility. The lodge operation had a full service registration, concierge, support staff, traditional lobby and bell service, maid service, guest facilities, dining, exercise, ski lockers and transportation services. Daniel stated there were 32 suites and 97 separate divisible rental rooms; the mix of suites was between 1 and 5 bedrooms. There were walk up units on South Aspen Street (the old Holland House parcel). Each member gets 14 nights in the winter between December 1 st and April lOth; 131 nights. Lodge members get time in the shoulder seasons and the members do not have specific ownership in any specific unit. Daniel said that over 65% ofthe visitors in the winter were 2 people, which shows that 1 or 2 bedrooms would be utilized. There were 8 memberships per suite that equaled 256 total memberships and the operator or owner owns the 2 ASPEN PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION MEETING- MINUTES- JULY 17. 2007 facility; they retain the right to rent those available keys when they are not in use by the members. Daniel said that it was important to have heads on pillows to help support the public restaurant. Erspamer asked if the public could book a room before 30 days. Allgaier said that when Community Development originally began talking about fractional ownership in 2001, the code was revised to include fractional ownership and operational provisions can make a fractional work well with more hotbeds. Vann said that this project was designed to the city's new incentive growth management regulations and lodge regulations, which were adopted in 2005. The affordable housing mitigation could be 30% as opposed to 60% of the new employees generated by lodge keys and the new commercial space. Vann said that there was a documented 38 keys on the site from the Holland House, Skiers Chalet Lodge and the Skiers Chalet Restaurant; so they have to mitigate for 30% of net new employees of the 59 employees or 9 employees; the mitigation was about 17'12 employees and they have proposed 11 affordable housing units or 20.25 employees on site. Vann noted Ski Co will assume the responsibility for their employees. Holly said there would be 6 deed-restricted units in the old Skiers Chalet Steakhouse. David Guthrie asked if there was an internal elevator in the restaurant. Daniel replied there was an internal elevator. Guthrie asked the size of the elevator. Holly answered it would be about 6' by 8' or 9' to accommodate a stretcher. Guthrie said the owner operator would keep the income from the public rental of units. Daniel said that during the unused plan period there would be a sharing with the members. Vann said that unlike a fractional ownership project where an owner owns a deeded interest in real estate; as a membership they will have no ability to hold a key back and there was the economic incentive for the owner/operator to rent the units. Guthrie asked if the restaurant would be open in the off-seasons. Daniel replied that it was too early to speculate about that. Erspamer asked if the lock off units worked well. Vann answered that he did not have any personal information on that even though the Hyatt was designed to address the same issue. Erspamer asked the width of the trail if the lift was moved up 120 feet that becomes an hour glass. Erspamer asked about the tax district. Daniel replied that it was their intent to form a tax improvement district in order to fund the improvements; if Aspen Mountain Lodge and the Lift One Lodge goes through 3 ASPEN PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION MEETING - MINUTES- JULY 17. 2007 then it would be both properties. Erspamer asked if there was parking for employee housing. Daniel replied yes. John Rowland asked ifthere were negotiations with the volleyball courts. Daniel answered that he had a conversation with Stephen Ellsperman; originally the Parks Department had 2 locations for the volleyball sand courts one was at Koch Lumber and for purposes of the community to disperse the courts; they are firmly committed for the replacement of those 2 courts. Rowland suggested the base of Lift lA. Rowland asked about the snow quality underneath the tunnel. Daniel said it would a 32' by 40' ski through and they have not worked out the logistics and they have a firm commitment to keep the snow. Rowland stated that originally the museum was setback in the corner and HPC wanted it brought forward. Daniel and Vann said this was HPC's preferred location up front. Public Comments: 1. Gail Morgan said that Bob said there wouldn't be any variances requested except for the elevators but it seems that much of the lodge was placed in the conservation zone. Morgan said that the public would have a better opportunity to use the museum ifit were near the lift. Allgaier said the zone change was part of the application. Allgaier said the Historic Preservation Commission would like to see the uses for the historic building be down on Dean Street. 2. Steve Knor asked how one prevents members from over booking units and then not using them. Allgaier said that as long as someone was using the unit it was better than having an empty unit; the walk-in was a desirable feature for the units to act like a lodge. 3. Vince Galluccio asked the incentive for these owners to let the operator rent the units. Daniel replied there was shared revenue. MOTION: LJ Erspamer moved to continue the Lift One Conceptual PUD/Timeshare top July 24th; seconded by David Guthrie. All in favor, APPROVED. CONTINUED PUBLIC HEARING (5/15/7): NORTH OF NELL PUD John Rowland opened the continued public on the North of Nell PUD. Jason Lasser explained that the packet was the same packet with a supplement addressing 4 ASPEN PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION MEETING- MINUTES- JULY 17. 2007 architectural character and site design. Lasser said that the North of Nell was built in 1969 in compliance with the standards at the time and now the uses were non- conforming with the floor area calculations. The commercial ratio was 1 to 1 and the residential was .5 to 1. Lasser said the saw tooth eve line looked up from the street did not show a straight eve line; this roofline was part of the architectural character to be maintained. Lasser noted that the North of Nell and the Aspen Square were the first two big buildings that initiated growth management and was part ofthe history of Aspen. Lasser said increasing the architectural element with a big chimney element and flues that come up about 4 or 5 feet. The architectural arch element was at the 42 foot height cut into the roof. There was concern for the vertical architectural elements as they come down to the first eve. Lasser said there was also concern for the color scheme from the Little Nell and Gondola Plaza extending to the North of Nell was that this might look like one base village. Stafffound that the building doesn't comply with the architecture character criteria; the pedestrian experience was uninviting and the sidewalk was narrow with trees. Lasser said the majority of the project was based upon Dean Street improvements; their plan was to put a new amount of retail on the Dean Street side. Glenn Horn introduced the architect, Randy Wedum, and the manager, Joe Raczak. Horn said that they were over on the residential floor area ratio. Horn said that Randy was adding a chase to the outside of the building to cover mechanical, which increased the residential floor area by 54 square feet. Horn said this was approved by 60 individual homeowners and it wasn't easy to dress up a shoe box. Randy Wedum stated they were breaking up the massing of a building that was a box; central elements (greenhouses) were added to beak up the roofs into three bays. Currently the railings go from one end of the building to the other so he added the vertical columns, which were fifteen feet from the front ofthe building and go over the air conditioner pipes and other wires. Wedum said they were under the 42 foot height limit. We dum said the city required a drainage system upon the remodel; they would put in a gutter system and drain into the storm drainage. Glenn Horn added that the biggest pedestrian amenity improvement would be to not have water dripping on people's heads. 5 ASPEN PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION MEETING- MINUTES- JULY 17. 2007 We dum said they were working with the Residences at Nell on Dean Street and the North of Nell was spending hundreds of thousands of dollars of improvements with staircases, sidewalk and snowmelt. Joe Raczak said that you would be able to walk from Durant Street to Dean Street through the building as a short cut. John Rowland asked about the columns not coming to the ground. Wedum replied the columns were 60 feet to 10 feet back like a cake stepping back from the upper floors; the columns were not structurally on the same line. Brian Speck asked if the car ramp was being expanded so it was not so dangerous. We dum replied that they never discussed the ramp only the lighting system; they could look into the ramp. Dylan Johns asked where the mechanical system was located and if stacks would be coming out above the eve line. We dum responded that they were not changing any mechanical; the chimney was on the roof and the elevator. LJ Erspamer asked if the city wanted to get rid of the overhangs from buildings. Jason Lasser replied that the over hang was okay but the columns were the real issue. Erspamer said the land use code wanted contemporary design; he said what was presented looked contemporary. Chris Bendon said that Gondola Plaza may be changing and there was no application yet but it was talked about by SkiCo. Joe Raczak said that the North of Nell cannot be misconstrued to be like the Little Nell or the Residences in any way. Wedum said the owners were not sure if they wanted the teal color either, so the final color of the railing was not decided. Erspamer said that they just received these changes an hour prior and he just found out that it doesn't comply with the architectural character. Erspamer asked about the pedestrian place coming from Durant to Starbucks; was that a public walkway or was it owned by the North of Nell. Lasser replied that what they own it was under their eve; the wall has been modified. Erspamer asked how the North of Nell could be liable for the pedestrian. Lasser responded that it was part of the PUD process to provide pedestrian amenities for open space. MOTION: Brian Speck moved to continue the meeting until 7: 15 pm; seconded by LJ Erspamer. All infavor, APPROVED. No public comments. 6 ASPEN PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION MEETING- MINUTES- JULY 17. 2007 Brian Speck said that this was consistent to open out towards the gondola tickets. There was discussion of the gutter system by the commission; David Guthrie said that the straight gutters were a matter of practicality rather than cost savings because the saw tooth would trap rather free flow water. Dylan Johns said that the saw tooth would compromise the gutter system and have obstacles in the drainage and would not work as well. Johns asked if it was the city philosophy to have more sun on the streets. Chris Bendon said the solar issue for streets was important. Johns said cutting back the roof overhang would improve the sun onto the streets. Joe Raczak said that the saw tooth roof doesn't function very well. Erspamer asked if the columns broke up the massing of the building. Lasser replied that it was difficult from this drawing and the overall plan should be looked at; the reality of the columns was that they were thin 8-12 inch wide fins. David Guthrie said that this was a box and he did not want to dress up a box. Johns said that P&Z was reviewing this because of a problem not started by this . building, Dean Street. Johns said that this was a good time to look at the safety of the ramp. Johns stated that they shouldn't have to foot the whole bill of cleaning up the sidewalk. John Rowland said it was difficult trying to revitalize an old building and wanted more detail on the columns on how they were integrated. Rowland said that the first floor was great with the glass doors but the other architectural styles were competing. MOTION: Dylan Johns moved to approve Resolution #019, 2007 for a Planned Unit Developmentfor the North of Nell Condominiums with conditions and the applicant will look into improving access into the garage; seconded by LJ Erspamer. Roll call vote: Speck, yes; Erspamer, yes; Guthrie, no; Johns, yes; Rowland, no. APPROVED 3-2. Discussion: Guthrie voted against because of the architecture; Rowland said the architectures competed with each other. MINUTES MOTION: John Rowland moved to approve the minutes from March 20, April 2 and April 3, May 1, May 15, June 5, and June 19,2007 with corrections by LJ 7 ASPEN PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION MEETING- MINUTES- JULY 17. 2007 Erspamer to 3/20,4/3, 6/5 & 6/19; seconded by LJ Erspamer. All infavor, APPROVED. Dylan Johns abstained. Adjourned at 7:30 p.m. ckie Lothian, Deputy City Clerk DECLARATION OF CONFLICTS OF INTEREST ............................................... 1 COMMENTS ............................................................................................................ 1 LIFT ONE CONCEPTUAL PUD/TIMESHARE .................................................... 1 NORTH OF NELL PUD........................................................................................... 4 MINUTES ................................................................................................................. 7 8